[Publisher] Xlibris

[Paul X]

Anybody have any comments on XLibris' quality and the prices of their books?

[Patricia Shipp Lieb]

I am currently having my second book published with Xlibris (1) Murders In The Swampland (2) Across The Red River to her Mysterious Heritage. I'm very pleased with the product and the services the company offered me. You can get information about it on the Xlibris Web site.
--Patricia Shipp Lieb

[RealityChuck]

How much money have you made from the sales of your books on Xlibris?

[wilson]

While xlibris have good quality, their books carry the highest prices around.
Who would pay $18 to $30 bucks for a paperback? And by an unknown author?
Something to think about. :\

[ardela dimwit]

look guys, heres a forum over at writers.net
somebody sent me an inquiry today about xlibris and your forum came up, but so did theirs

Forum: xlibris
www.writers.net/forum/read/13/639/421Vt (http://www.writers.net/forum/read/13/639/421Vt)
at writers.net

several comments here that may be worth looking into
actually an excellent source for insight. many complaints of unprofessional or improper management here along with criticisms on pricing and market problems

one guy lost his first chapter it seems

so hop over there. sorry for butting in, but it looked too good to pass up.

[mollyross]

I published my novel with Xlibris, and everything went well till my 230 page book came out at $25 for a hardcover edition, and $18 for trade paperback. Less than a year later the prices went up. It's hard to convince anyone to buy your book at those prices. Family and friends are just about the only people who bought it.

The services I got cost $750 in the year 2000, and I believe the price has gone up since then.

I won't use them again. :eek

[Patricia Shipp Lieb]

I think I get 25 percent of what the books sell for. Some sell over the Xlibris Web site, but most sell when I present talks. I'm collecting advice from people who have seen my notes on this message board and replied. I just need to work harder at marketing, and that is hard since my true love is doing the writing.
Patricia Shipp Lieb

[James D Macdonald]

Xlibris is at it again, or still, or something.

They're now trolling the fan fiction archives for addresses to send their spam.

This post shows a little bit about how they work, and about what they cost:

<a href="http://www.livejournal.com/users/spikewriter/131936.html" target="_new">www.livejournal.com/users/spikewriter/131936.html</a>

[Stephenie Hovland]

I just got an advertisement from them last week. I'm assuming it's from being on Writer's Digest mailing list.

I feel so special now.:tongue

Stephenie

[emeraldcite]

I was looking at the livejournal that mr. mcdonald posted. just some more math for you:


That's $2,030 to publish a book that's going to cost $23 on Amazon

the live journalist came up with this number after going through all the recommended processes. This is how much you'll probably spend if you want to "do things right."

from the email:
To date, we have published over 8,000 titles, paid our authors more than $1 million in royalties,

okay, let's just look at the numbers provided by xlibris. let's say those 8,000 titles sold evenly well, that would work out to a whopping $125 a piece.

makes you think about that investment. don't need to call greenspan on this one.

[James D Macdonald]

It may also be worth noting that the current spam letter from Mercedes at Xlibris contains one of those little invisible bits of code that tells Xlibris whether you've opened it, how many times you opened it, whether you forwarded it, and to whom.

[bentbrains]

What a rip off! $125 in royalties? :money :lol They are by far the most expensive service out there. It would cost much less to print it yourself, and looking at some of their product, it would probably look as good if not better!!!:snoopy :

[thorgunna]

I get spam from Xlibris. Except for the fact Piers Anthony is a part of that group--and I adore Piers Anthony--I would hit "block."

Darragha
www.darraghafoster.com

[Markallen]

Xlibris has fired 35 people who worked in Philadelphia fielding phone calls. Those jobs were outsourced to a call center in the Philipines. I wonder how many books Random House (who owns Xlibris) sells to those islands. It is a real trip talking to a 3 dollar an hour "Authors Representative" about the book you spent years writing. They answer questions from a menu. They have no idea what you are talking about and could care less. What a JOKE!!!!

[aka eraser]

Ouch Mark, that would hurt. My sympathies.

[James D Macdonald]

Random House makes it very plain that books published by Xlibris are not Random House books.

[priceless1]

Geez, if the 'service' is as impressive as the people we talked to in India over our computer problems, God help those authors. We could understood roughly every third word. I hope those authors don't suffer for this move.

[Selenia692]

I had my tech support job outsourced to India (well, certain product support was shifted over to India and many of my co workers were fired for 'extraneous' reasons to that) about two years back, before that I had to deal with extremely pissed off people that managed to get in on the few products we still supported at our center, and bitched to high heaven about it. It wasn't a pretty sight :(

[HapiSofi]

Outsourcing customer support to Elbonia is all the rage these days. I cherish the story about the programmer who privately outsourced his $75,000/yr. job to a programmer in India who's delighted to be getting $12,000/yr. for the same work. The guy's employer thinks he's telecommuting. The guy says he's thinking about applying for a second job. I want to see whether employers are going to dare to complain about the practice.

Personally, I'm in favor of outsourcing right-wing pundits' jobs. India has more college graduates than any other country in the world. I'm sure there are some of them who could write Heritage Foundation position papers for a fraction of the going price. Next: maquiladora think tanks!

Invisible hand's a b*tch. But I digress.

Anyway, hearing about this isn't much help, but at least this way you have the consolation of knowing that you're part of a larger cultural trend.

[Euan Harvey]

Personally, I'm in favor of outsourcing right-wing pundits' jobs.

They'd make more sense than Ann Coulter, that's for sure...

[Assuming that is, you can call her a pundit, rather than, say, a plasticized raving lunatic]

[mburrell]

I just got a call from a very polite gentleman with one of those outsourcing accents who asked me if his company, Xlibris, might be of assistance in publishing my book. When I asked him where he got my name and telephone number, he claimed he didn't know.

I have sent out a number of queries and sample chapters--even full manuscripts to some small presses. These are the only places that I can remember mentioning both my telephone number and my manuscript. My question is, have any of you ever heard of traditional publishing houses selling information to vanity presses like Xlibris?

[James D Macdonald]

My question is, have any of you ever heard of traditional publishing houses selling information to vanity presses like Xlibris?

Some marginal publishers and agents get involved in shady deals, including selling names and addresses. See the whole tragic history of Edit Ink for an example.

Xlibris has a history of asking publishers for the contact information from manuscripts that those publishers rejected. Major publishers refuse that sort of offer out of hand. The bottom feeders ... well.

There's not just black and white in this world -- there's a whole lot of shades of grey.

[XThe NavigatorX]

They called me several months ago, too, and I a) have an unlisted number and b) am on that do-not-call list. I abused the poor gentlman for about thirty seconds and hung up on him.

I don't know where they get the info, but I get all sorts of junk snail mail to my house, too.

I think they legally have to tell you where they got your name from. I hadn't thought to ask at the time.

[vstrauss]

Did you register copyright? That might explain it. A lot of shady agents and fee-based publishers use copyright registration lists to solicit clients.

- Victoria

[maestrowork]

I've heard of vanity press soliciting clients through email, but I've never heard of them actually calling. That's a little unnerving and intrusive.

[scullars]

Interestingly enough, I just got an email today from XLibris. I have never received one before, so I'm wondering whether they surfed Absolute Write and got my email from my profile.

[Simran]

Not only have they moved overseas but also they were horrible at editing even before that. I was able to land an editing job because an author sent his manuscript to Xlibris and they printed it without editing it first. Then, while the unedited editions were selling (much to his embarrassment), I stepped in and edited the novel for him. He resubmitted it to the company and they not only charged him for this but when they printed it out there were new mistakes that they had made in the process.

I have proofread this novel at least 5 times, as each time we resubmit with their mistakes highlighted, they only take out some of them. And they have the nerve to charge him every time!!!!!!! Finally after a year of going back and forth the newest edition is free of mistakes. Now the problem is ordering from them. They take anywhere from 6-8 weeks because they wait until they have enough orders before printing the books!

Is there anything we can do about this????????

[JerseyGirl1962]

Judi,

I'm not a lawyer, and hindsight is 20/20, but maybe your client could have saved some headaches by going with a decent POD outfit like lulu.com. They seem to be upstanding as far as POD companies go...

Which of course doesn't answer your question. Maybe your client can get out of the contract by showing it to a lawyer? That's the only suggestion I have.

What a way to run a railroad. :Headbang:

Euan,

A plasticized raving lunatic!! That made my morning! :Cheers:

~Nancy

[victoriastrauss]

Not only have they moved overseas but also they were horrible at editing even before that. I was able to land an editing job because an author sent his manuscript to Xlibris and they printed it without editing it first. Then, while the unedited editions were selling (much to his embarrassment), I stepped in and edited the novel for him. He resubmitted it to the company and they not only charged him for this but when they printed it out there were new mistakes that they had made in the process.Xlibris is pretty specific on its site that it doesn't provide editing. The book is set up as you send it. So if this author didn't realize that, he wasn't doing very careful research.

Most POD self-publishing companies send you a .pdf to proof before the book goes into production. That's the time to make corrections. If you make corrections after that--yes, you do get charged. This is usually spelled out in the contract.

Xlibris has its share of problems, and some of the information on its website can produce unrealistic expectations in inexperienced authors about the likelihood of success. Xlibris is also one of the more expensive of the POD self-publishing services. But it's not Xlibris's fault if authors expect services it clearly indicates it doesn't provide, or fail to read the fine print in their contracts. Sorry to sound unsympathetic--but Writer Beware gets so many "complaints" about this sort of thing, and I get a little tired sometimes of explaining the concept of personal responsibility.

- Victoria

[James D. Macdonald]

Bottom line for anyone considering Xlibris: They're a vanity POD.

[Simran]

Judi,

I'm not a lawyer, and hindsight is 20/20, but maybe your client could have saved some headaches by going with a decent POD outfit like lulu.com. They seem to be upstanding as far as POD companies go...

Which of course doesn't answer your question. Maybe your client can get out of the contract by showing it to a lawyer? That's the only suggestion I have.

What a way to run a railroad. :Headbang:

Euan,

A plasticized raving lunatic!! That made my morning! :Cheers:

~Nancy

Thanks jerseygirl. The reason why he went to them was Random House didn't want to publish his book so they recommended Xlibris. At least he finally has a corrected edition. Hopefully sales will start picking up for him. It's a great novel. I hope someday Random House will kick themselves for not being the publishers when he makes it to the Oprah Show. :)

[Simran]

Xlibris is pretty specific on its site that it doesn't provide editing. The book is set up as you send it. So if this author didn't realize that, he wasn't doing very careful research.

Most POD self-publishing companies send you a .pdf to proof before the book goes into production. That's the time to make corrections. If you make corrections after that--yes, you do get charged. This is usually spelled out in the contract.

Xlibris has its share of problems, and some of the information on its website can produce unrealistic expectations in inexperienced authors about the likelihood of success. Xlibris is also one of the more expensive of the POD self-publishing services. But it's not Xlibris's fault if authors expect services it clearly indicates it doesn't provide, or fail to read the fine print in their contracts. Sorry to sound unsympathetic--but Writer Beware gets so many "complaints" about this sort of thing, and I get a little tired sometimes of explaining the concept of personal responsibility.

- Victoria

thanks Victoria. I can understand where you're coming from. Unfortunately, from my understanding, Xlibris sold him a package that included editing. And even if his manuscript had been free of the few mistakes, they really did him in by making 99 mistakes of their own! Then the author service rep had the nerve to write and tell him that "the correction team seems to have misplaced the corrections" that he submitted.

[aadams73]

Xlibris has fired 35 people who worked in Philadelphia fielding phone calls. Those jobs were outsourced to a call center in the Philipines.

Oh geez! I refuse to do business with anyone--just on principal--who outsources jobs. I've always found Indian people to be warm and friendly but I refuse to deal with them in terms of customer support.

[James D. Macdonald]

James D. Macdonald said:

Woo hoo!

Travis Tea, author of the acclaimed Atlanta Nights (http://www.lulu.com/content/102550), just got this letter from Xlibris sent to the email address on Travis's homepage!




Dear Travis,

My name is Tracey Rosengrave, Marketing Manager for Xlibris Corporation, a Print-On-Demand Self-Publishing company. We are sending you this email because we have either learned about your passion for writing or we have had the pleasure of coming across some of your work. If you are interested in self-publishing, I’ve included a brief description of who we are below.

I do send out follow up messages, so if you are not interested in our company or services please click here and I will send no further correspondence. I completely understand how annoying unwanted email messages can be; if this is the case here, my sincerest apologies.

For those who would like more information…

Xlibris is partially owned by Random House Ventures, the world’s largest trade book publisher. We have published over 14,000 titles and paid out over $1.6 million in royalties. Everyday we help authors by offering flexible, inexpensive methods of publishing, editing, marketing, distributing and selling books both in trade and full color. I understand that each author has different requirements. And that is why we offer packages that are tailored to your individual needs. At Xlibris we believe in autho

If you would like to find out more about us, visit our website www.xlibris.com (http://www.xlibris.com/) or email us at info@xlibris.com. Or better yet call us at 1-888-795-4274 -- we are open 24/7. Be sure to ask your publishing consultant for a free publishing kit and book sample when you call. You can also order a publishing kit online by clicking here.

I thank you very much for your time and look forward to hearing from you.


Sincerest Regards,


Tracey Rosengrave
Marketing Manager
Xlibris Corporation


The letter included one of those little e-mail code bugs that's designed to show if the letter's been read, how often, if it's been forwarded, and so on.

XThe NavigatorX said:

I can't imagine they'd have too much success with people who'd already discovered Lulu.

James D. Macdonald said:

The truncated sentence Quote:
At Xlibris we believe in autho
is verbatim from the letter.

Gracious -- I'm half-tempted to give them a call and ask how much they'd be willing to pay me to reprint Atlanta Nights (http://www.travistea.com/).

Oh -- $1.6 million, divided by 14,000 titles, works out to $114 per title. Boy, where do I go to sign up?

PattiTheWicked said:

Oddly, I got that same email today from the same person. Mine didn't have the "autho" part, though, it had an actual sentence there.

Sadly, this means I'm in the same ranks as Travis Tea. 'Scuse me while I go slash my wrists.


James D. Macdonald said:


Quote:
Originally Posted by PattiTheWicked
Mine didn't have the "autho" part, though, it had an actual sentence there.



I'm dying to know: What's the rest of the paragraph?

PattiTheWicked said:



Quote:
Originally Posted by James D. Macdonald
I'm dying to know: What's the rest of the paragraph?



"And that is why we offer packages that are tailored to your individual needs. At Xlibris we believe in author control. "

Apparently control doesn't reach as far as we thought though, since I never signed up to be on their mailing list in the first place.

James D. Macdonald said:

Well, they've outsourced their production to the Phillipines, and they've outsourced their acquisitions to a Spam Haus.

I wonder what's left?

On the good side, they didn't say that their books would be available from sea to shining sea.


PeeDee said:

Er. Apparently, that control doesn't even reach to the complete end of that sentence. http://66.116.174.26/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif

Dawno said:


I got the email as well and let Google know I considered it spam. (It was in my inbox)

Maryn said:


I feel so left out and overlooked--I didn't get the email!

Maryn, sobbing uncontrollably (and just wishing she had that ol' Xlibris 'author control'!)

Ivonia said:


Hmm, I got that email too, and it was essentially word for word what Uncle Jim posted here (I didn't really check it over though, once I saw "Print on demand", I knew that was enough to delete it).

I'm wondering how they got my email in the first place, hmm...

underthecity said:

Well, that's weird. I too got the same email from Xlibris. The email went to my OLD old email address that is still active in just a couple of places: eBay and Writers.net. I'm wondering, for those others who have received the email, are you active on WN? I know Jim is (but not as Travis Tea, of course). If so, that could be where Xlibris harvested the emails. I don't have my OLD old email registered at AW.

Just a thought.

I'm considering sending Xlibris a very sarcastic response.

allen

PattiTheWicked said:


I'm not registered on Writers Net, and my Ebay address is different than the one they sent it to.

Wonder if it has anything to do with those black helicopters that keep appearing over my house?


PixelFish said:

I'm not registered at Writers.net nor do I have an eBay account, but I got that Xlibris spam, same as everyone else.

(Odd, though, how hearing or reading the words, "We understand you like to write," or variants thereof, make me react. My heart leaps and something inside goes, "Why, yes! Yes, I do like to write." And then I realise it's a scam and there's an odd subsiding feeling.)

[Jaws]

Heck, my e-mail address specifically attacks outfits like XLibris and I still got the spam!

As an aside, XLibris (et al., as this also includes our good friends at PA) demonstrate two corollaries to the Law of Large Numbers. The Law of Large Numbers tells us that for a sufficiently large sample of instances, even a startling unlikely event has a reasonable chance of happening, so long as it is not literally impossible. For example, if one flips a coin enough times, there's a decent chance that somewhere in there one can find fifty heads in a row.

Corollaries:
1. Psychologically, the existence of that one run of fifty heads causes people to neglect the sample size. If I've done the math correctly, to have a 3% probability of finding fifty heads in a row when flipping a fair coin, one would need to flip the coin 1.75 trillion times, or thereabouts. If I'm off, it's only by one order of magnitude or so; so I think we can safely say one billion. That's a sample size of one billion to get a rationalizable chance of fifty to line up.

2. Usually, the large numbers are so large that even people who know the math won't do it.

[tarra74]

That does sound a bit shady. I once published through them. I never got paid any royalties, although my book was selling. I told them I wanted out of my contract so I could go elsewhere for publication of my book, which they agreed to. They told me my contract was cancelled, but there was one copy in the system that they had no control over. Someone here in my town bought the book and brought it to me to autograph. There's still new copies of it being sold, meaning Xlibris is still printing up copies and pocketing the money.

Now when I self publish, I go through Lulu - it's free and your book is available within minutes, and you can edit and unpublish your book through them at anytime.

[tarra74]

Not only have they moved overseas but also they were horrible at editing even before that. I was able to land an editing job because an author sent his manuscript to Xlibris and they printed it without editing it first. Then, while the unedited editions were selling (much to his embarrassment), I stepped in and edited the novel for him. He resubmitted it to the company and they not only charged him for this but when they printed it out there were new mistakes that they had made in the process.

I have proofread this novel at least 5 times, as each time we resubmit with their mistakes highlighted, they only take out some of them. And they have the nerve to charge him every time!!!!!!! Finally after a year of going back and forth the newest edition is free of mistakes. Now the problem is ordering from them. They take anywhere from 6-8 weeks because they wait until they have enough orders before printing the books!

Is there anything we can do about this????????

When I published with Xlibris, I worked hard to make sure my manuscript was free of mistakes before I submitted it to them. My mom and sister, as well as several other people I know ordered copies. To my embarrassment, my sister brought me her copy and she had marked all the mistakes in it. There were ten mistakes at least on each page that were not in my orriginal manuscript I had submitted to them. The orriginal manuscript was free of mistakes while the printed book was full of them.

When I contacted them about this, I was told that I had to purchase an editing bundle. Each bundle only covered so many edits and I would have had to buy enough editing bundles to cover every edit that needed to be made. It was more than I could afford and I didn't feel I should have to pay money just to correct their mistakes, so I didn't pay it. I stopped proting the book. I wasn't even getting paid royalties for the copies that did sell. I'm happy to say I'm out of the contract I had with them.

I think they purposely fill the books with mistakes to make money off their authors. I got a letter from Xlibris not long ago offering to give me a discount if I would publish another book with them. I ripped it up and threw it in the trash.

[tony]

My book was self published in Ireland in 1994 and reproduced in 2004 by Xlibris, Philadelphia - a POD publisher. All seemed ok initially but after paying them $1,360 they got careless and began giving misinformation and I had been messed about by at least twelve different staff members. Information about media contacts they had agreed to dispatch was ignored and it was five months later when they decided to informed me about it. Around the same time they had also agreed to a free offer for a newswire campaign. The staff member who had agreed to this left the company and the rest of the staff washed their hands of the issue. One of the contacts was very interested and said that if they were not able to help they knew who to get it to. I was very disappointed with this frauding POD Publisher that I requested a refund of the money I had paid. The manager apologised in a telephone conversation and offered to pay compensation for the manner in which I had been treated. He accepted that I had been misled by two staff members. He later changed his mind about the offer. I was wondering if there was a legal person who would send them a letter in the hope they might reconsider the offer. I don’t have a working income and am not able to pay for the services of a solicitor. I am deaf and finding communication difficult except of course by email. I hope you can help me.Thank You,tony

[Julie Worth]

You leave me wondering if your book was even comprehensible, because your posting sure isn't. Something about wanting your money back because of this messing...?

[Chacounne]

Uh, Julie, remember the prime rule of this board: Respect your fellow writer, no matter where they are in their journey.

Just my two cents,
Chac

[Chacounne]

Welcome to the Water Cooler, Tony,

There's lots of expertise here, but I'm not sure if anyone can help you with your particular problem.

Using the search function here, I did find this URL, but I don't know much more about them:

http://www.landoltlawoffice.com/FAQ2.html

Best Wishes,
Chac

[Julie Worth]

Uh, Julie, remember the prime rule of this board: Respect your fellow writer, no matter where they are in their journey.

Just my two cents,
Chac

Sorry, tony. I’d been reading one of the threads about the 20 worst agents, and I was in that kind of mood.

[tony]

Welcome to the Water Cooler, Tony,

There's lots of expertise here, but I'm not sure if anyone can help you with your particular problem.

Using the search function here, I did find this URL, but I don't know much more about them:

http://www.landoltlawoffice.com/FAQ2.html

Best Wishes,
Chac

Thanks so much Chacounne. The link info was very helpful. I am awaiting a reply from it.

[Capt Dink]

While xlibris have good quality, their books carry the highest prices around.
Who would pay $18 to $30 bucks for a paperback? And by an unknown author?
Something to think about. :\

They ask a high price ($18-$30) for your book because they make more money from you when you buy your own books! They probably don't expect any sales beyond what you buy.

[Gillhoughly]

"We have published over 14,000 titles and paid out over $1.6 million in royalties."

Average that out: each writer made a whopping 114.28 on their book--over a period of how many years they've been in business???

And that's DOWN from the previous average of 125.00 mentioned earlier in this post. :e2hammer:

A few years back I got a trolling snail-mail letter from these clowns. They'd gotten my address from a writing magazine I'd subscribed to--when I specifically asked NOT to have my address given or sold to any mailing list.

It seems that Xlibris heard that I was very close to being published!!! (I'd sold some 20 novels to major print houses by then.)

They presented me with an Exciting Offer. Exciting, but not new--I pay them money (the "basic package" was from 500.00- 1,500.00), they publish my book.

They will "respect" (translated: not edit) my MS, unless I would like to use their shiny new editing service which worked out to be 1.00 for every hundred words.

Gosh, and my other publishers do that for FREE.

Hmm, tough choice: should you drop four figures on Xlibris so they can put a bad cover with your name on it up on their website or should you GET four figures from a publisher who will put a copy in the bookstores, libraries, and Amazon, etc. The cover might still be bad, but at least you know they checked the spelling and grammar.

Crunch the numbers: how many copies will you have to sell to make back the money you gave Xlibris?

Are you willing to stand in a parking lot on odd Saturdays selling them from from your trunk? (I've seen it!)

Or would you rather be home putting that energy into writing the next book?

I know how tempting it is to go for instant publishing gratification, but stick it out and keep working to get with a print house who will pay you for your work. It took me 3-4 years and tons of rewrites before I got in the door, but it was SO worth it. When people asked, "Where can I get your book?" I was able name the bookstore down the street, not hand them a web address to look up.

"The money flows to the writer, the money flows to the writer...."

[Simran]

When I published with Xlibris, I worked hard to make sure my manuscript was free of mistakes before I submitted it to them. My mom and sister, as well as several other people I know ordered copies. To my embarrassment, my sister brought me her copy and she had marked all the mistakes in it. There were ten mistakes at least on each page that were not in my orriginal manuscript I had submitted to them. The orriginal manuscript was free of mistakes while the printed book was full of them.

When I contacted them about this, I was told that I had to purchase an editing bundle. Each bundle only covered so many edits and I would have had to buy enough editing bundles to cover every edit that needed to be made. It was more than I could afford and I didn't feel I should have to pay money just to correct their mistakes, so I didn't pay it. I stopped proting the book. I wasn't even getting paid royalties for the copies that did sell. I'm happy to say I'm out of the contract I had with them.

I think they purposely fill the books with mistakes to make money off their authors. I got a letter from Xlibris not long ago offering to give me a discount if I would publish another book with them. I ripped it up and threw it in the trash.

Sorry that you had to go this too Tarra. :( I think you're right, it does seem that they purposely fill the books with mistakes, just so they can charge you to fix them. :rant:

[JennaGlatzer]

I dearly hope Xlibris will regret sending me junk mail. Here's a bit of analysis on their latest.

I'm skipping to the "Why Should You Self-Publish?" section.

Six good reasons to self-publish:
1. Time
Traditional publishing takes too long, most work on an 18-month production cycle: Choose to self-publish, and your book could be ready for the market within three months.

Aside from the fact that whoever wrote this letter doesn't have a clue how to use commas or colons, there's also the other issue-- it's designed to appeal to the impatient. Publishing is not an industry for the impatient.

There's a good reason why real publishing takes "too long." Three months is NOT enough time to publish a book (with rare exceptions, when a publisher needs to publish something timely and puts a book on a fast-track schedule).

A person who is self-publishing for the first time needs to understand that there are many steps involved-- necessary steps, not optional steps. The book needs to be written and self-edited, then a content editor needs to work on it, then a copyeditor. While this is happening, a cover artist should be working on the cover and a publicist should be working on a press kit. Then a typesetter will work on the book's layout, and a proofreader will go over it once it's in galley format to make sure the formatting is all correct and that there are no stray typos or other errors.

Trade magazines such as Kirkus, Library Journal, Publishers Weekly, etc. want to see galleys months in advance of publication. Of course, you're not likely to get any trade reviews if you print your book with Xlibris, but trade reviews are highly important if you want to make sales to bookstores and libraries. Buyers for these markets read the trade magazines to figure out which books to stock. They also want to see the publisher's catalogue, which your book should be in well before its release date. This gives the stores time to order and stock the book; if you wait until after the book comes out to try to sell it, you're dead in the water.

Other things a real publisher may do during those "18 months" (which, in my experience, is typically no more than 12 months): have the book indexed, solicit cover blurbs, have a copywriter write jacket copy, send excerpts to magazines, set up a media tour and/or book signings, bring the book to book expos...

In short, real publishers aren't just dragging their heels. They plan releases on a particular schedule for a reason. They know when certain books are likely to sell best (so they plan release dates accordingly), and they want sufficient time to do a good job, rather than rushing to print just because an author is excited.

2. Your book-the way you want it
A book is a reflection of the author. Self-publishing gives you complete control on the direction of your book. The decisions are exclusively yours and not limited by third parties with intentions and interests different from your own.

If your interest is in selling lots of books, then those "third parties" (real publishers) have the exact same intention and interest.

This part of the Xlibris letter is designed to make it seem like real publishing is "author vs. publisher" in an adversarial relationship, where the author has to fight with the mean, mean people who want to ruin his or her work. Please.

It's true that publishing is a collaborative business, and that compromises will need to be made, and that sometimes you won't get exactly the font or cover art or subtitle you want. But you will get a several-thousand-dollar investment from the publisher, who hires professionals to help determine how to sell as many copies of your book as possible. If you're the type of person who would rather go it alone than allow an editor to change one word of your precious manuscript, go right ahead and self-publish. And bless your heart.

3. Retain all rights
As a self-publisher, you own all rights to your book. If you use a traditional publisher, they will own all rights. If they lose interest in your book, you will not be able to print additional copies unless you purchase those rights back.

Okay, now they're outright lying. Did they hire PublishAmerica's PR person to write this deceitful letter?

If you publish with a real publisher, the copyright is still yours. Specific rights belong to the book publisher for the period of time the book is in print. (Such as the right to print the hardcover book in English in your country. You negotiate who will control the other rights; for example, sometimes you'll keep foreign rights to sell on your own or with your agent's help, and sometimes the publisher is in a better position than you are to exploit those rights-- in which case, they make the sales and keep a portion of the money, and you get to sit back and get checks.) Your contract should have an "out of print" clause that defines when the book is no longer being sold, and at that point, all rights should revert to you-- free of charge. You can then self-publish, take it to a new publisher, put it up on your website... whatever you like.

4. Testing the market
Because your book may fill a niche that has not been met, you can test the market by self-publishing. Find out how well your book will sell, and how successful it will be.

What spectacularly bad advice. Publishing with Xlibris does not give you an idea of how well your book would actually sell if you had sold it to a real publisher. All it tells most of its authors is how many copies they can sell to their poor Aunt Edna and Uncle George.

Publishers are not eager to buy the rights to books that have already been published-- even if it was self-published and sold only 10 copies to your buddies, it is "used goods." You've used up your first publishing rights and made it appear that your book is a terrific flop.

Very few self-published books are picked up by larger presses. Note that Random House, which Xlibris boasts is their "strategic partner" (it even says so on their letterhead), has never picked up an Xlibris manuscript. Never.

In other words, if you decide to "test" the market this way, chances are excellent that your book will never go beyond "testing." It's a double-edged sword: sell few books and it'll look like your book has no market, sell too many and real publisher will think you've already used up your market. They want to be the first to bring your book to print. Don't be impatient. Work on that book until it's publishable by a real publisher.

5. A limited market
Your book may appeal to a limited market (intricacies of microscopic vascular plants, for example) and therefore not be of interest to a large publishing house.

True. What about small publishing houses? What about university presses? Think of them before you'd give your manuscript to Xlibris. And then think of conventional self-publishing (where you actually hire an editor and a cover artist, get quotes from printers, etc.), which carries a greater financial risk but has better odds of success.

6. Legacy
Each of us has a unique life story to tell, complete with ordinary incidents, moments of brilliance, tragedy and humor. Your book is an expression of yourself and a great legacy to leave behind.

And there you have one of the few legitimate reasons to self-publish through a vanity POD publisher. If your REAL, TRUE, SWEAR TO ZEUS intention is simply to have a book you can hand to your grandkids and cousins and neighbors, any POD publisher is probably fine for you. If you have any secret desire to see your book on bookstore shelves, or have strangers read your book, hold out for a real publisher.

--
More on this later. I promised my husband I'd watch a movie with him 20 minutes ago...

[JennaGlatzer]

OK, back for a few more comments.

We offer a professional copyediting package...

That's sad. This sales letter is full of mistakes that no competent copyeditor would let slip by. Why would you trust this company to copyedit your work if they don't copyedit their own promotional material?

For example: extra spaces in between words for no reason, and capitalized words that shouldn't be capitalized ("Marketing Services," "Exclusive Offer," etc.).

Become a Published Author For Only $299

Allow me to remind you of Yog's Law: Money flows toward the writer.

Dress it up any way you like, but this is vanity publishing and its sales are nearly always disappointing to the authors. Vanity-published books sell an average of 75 copies. Is that what you want for your book?

[Popeyesays]

Enjoy the baby while she's still a baby--the days will flash by. My younger daughter graduates from high school Sunday--top 2%, an amazing musician and receiving scholarships to make her ride almost free. As a young woman she's a joy, but occasionally the urge to cuddle that baby just one more time is simply overwhelming.

Regards,
Scott

[HapiSofi]

Guys, this is weird. We have more than one person reporting the repeated introduction of new errors into XLibris books. This violates two basic rules of production:1. The easiest thing to do with a text is nothing at all.

2. Unless you're talking about random cosmic rays interacting with computer systems, there's no such thing as spontaneously generated errors.
Typos drive authors crazy. They're strongly motivated to do whatever it takes to fix the errors. XLibris is the only entity that can fix them, and they charge the author for doing so.

Isn't anyone else here wondering whether XLibris has made typos a profit center?

[James D. Macdonald]

I think it's mere incompetence, stemming from outsourcing everything to folks who don't speak English as a native tongue.

Though making typos a profit center wouldn't be out of the question for a spam/vanity house.

[DaveKuzminski]

Having briefly worked for some bosses in the distant past who would deliberately put shoddy products on the shelves to sell, I won't put it past someone introducing errors in order to charge for the corrections. There are simply too many unprincipled people in this world to ignore that as a possibility.

[victoriastrauss]

Though making typos a profit center wouldn't be out of the question for a spam/vanity house.With AuthorHouse, you get three proof changes; more than that, and you have to pay $25 (I think) per correction.

Sometimes, as we've seen with PublishAmerica, the errors are the result of the conversion process to PDF.

- Victoria

[Pamster]

I feel bad for a guy I know who published with Xlibris and is proud of it-he has yet to see his book and I know he's going to find errors there he didn't have in his ms. Just from reading this it makes me relieved to have once again FOUND solid info on a shady operation I want to stay clear of all thanks to you guys here and this awesome Bewares & Background Check forum on AW. You guys are the best! :D

[narnia]

As an FYI, I got this in an spam-email from xLibris today, thought I'd share:
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/277908/7_steps_to_successful_selfpublishing.html

I wanted to reproduce it here but it says copywrited so I wasn't sure if I could...

[Carraig]

Hi there, I'm new and I'm a writer-holic. Oops, sorry. Wrong thread for that :D

I have a long, sad story about XLibris, so go get your coffee.

For five years, I worked primarily through Elance.com. In the Fall of 2002, I was hired to ghost write a series of dating stories for a book to be called "I"m With Stupid - Dating Stories From the Edge of Insanity". The client's screen name was thepoisonedpen, but her real name is Aurealia Nelson. She has at times also gone by the names Amba Siddhi, Amba Chatterjee, and Sun Karma.

I humbly admit that at the time, I was too dumb to secure payment in some way. I ended up getting less than half the money owed me for six stories, which ended up comprising 1/3 of the book.

I came to find out in February of 2003, that Nelson had filed for bankruptcy in September of 2002, and then proceeded to hire some $1500 worth of services on Elance, most of which was never paid, including me. After some months of sporadic, nasty emails, she claimed she didn't owe me anything, the stories were hers, and I would get paid when it was published. End of contact. I forgot: her bankruptcy attorney told me she should not have incurred more debts. No kidding :Shrug:

I knew she was looking to shop it to self publishers, because if you Google her name or even look on amazon, she has no fewer than NINE self published books. And I can assure you from our personal contact, that she is not capable of writing any of them. But I digress. In surfing titles, I found an announcement of impending publication in Sept.2004 of the book.

I immediately wrote Ex Libris and got in contact with a publication specialisty, Stacey Spina, who was the only reasonable person in this whole mess. I sent her my manuscipts which proved I had written s substantial part of the content, because how else would I have gotten hold of it before it was published? Stacey told me it would not be published until Nelson paid them, too. She'd tried to stiff Xlibris as well.

She was hot on the trail of it, and assured me that their legal dept. would have the book pulled. Then our contact broke off. The book came out, and still I had not heard from her. Turned out she was "no longer with them", and I had to start all over.

[FONT='Times New Roman']To shorten the story, I corresponded with one of their people for over a year. In total, I sent three sets of my work to them, registered mail, for their examination. I was assured it was being considered.

What I got in the end, despite even registered letters to the head of the company and calls to Random House, was a letter stating that because Ms. Nelson (the book has been published under two of her pseudonyms) signed the author agreement stating that she is the original author, their lawyers advised them that they must accept her word. Despite all the proof I sent them.

The book is still listed on amazon. If you go look, you'll find my "review" and comments from two other writers that she stiffed.

So chalk up one more black mark against Ex Libris.

[CCE]

In 1999 I had my first contact with Xlibris after being advised to seek a non-traditional publishing company for my novel "Courage of the Heart" (Although I had been writing for years, and published in several newspapers and trade mags, my wiriting was a totally different ilk and several agents/publishers told me I was a "newbie" in the novel market).

At the time Xlibris offered a COMPLETELY FREE base package and assured writers that "not everyone got accepted" - so I was thrilled when they sent me a letter of acceptance. The galleys they sent me had errors that were not in my original manuscript - I corrected them and sent them back. when the book finally came out in June 2001, there was one new error (typesetting) which I was told would cost x$ to fix; I didn't.

When the book came out, it cost $16.00; currently the book is listed for sale at $21.69! Twenty some odd copies have sold and I have made barely enough to cover 2 purchases at the full (current) price.

I receive periodic emails offerering me services for a rather hefty fee to help market the book. Xlibris did nothing besides listing the book for sale on their website, Amazon.com, Barnes & Noble.com and for a while Walmart.com. As a new author I did not undersand the concept of self-marketing either.

I have heard of a few "happy authors" with Xlibris and repeat customers - I spoke with one and learned how much he invested in both their marketing programs and buying books himself to sell at flea markets and other places. I don't have that kind of money to invest.

I did not go back to Xlibris with any more manuscripts and MAY look to republish this first book elsewhere.

[Careann]

It's interesting to me to know this thread exists with its many negative responses about xlibris and yet a moment ago when I logged on to AW I found the main page sporting an advertisement for them. Advertising here doesn't make them legitimate, of course, and granted, it was a Google-sponsored link, but it still seemed pretty wierd.

[CaoPaux]

AW does block outright scams, but there's only so much one can do about the huge number of Very Bad Ideas. Which is why there's a disclaimer under the ad box.

[copnovelist1]

GOOD EVEENING WRITERS,

I AM SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING SPENDING $12,299.00 WITH XLIBRIS PUBLISHING TO PUBLISH MY NOVEL; "THE EXECUTION OF JUSTICE", BASED ON A THE MURDER OF AN INDIANAPOLIS POLICE HOMICIDE DETECTIVE, AND THE EXECUTION OF HIS KILLERS.

XLIBRIS CLAIMS TO BE A "STRATEGIC PARTNER OF RANDOM HOUSE".

IF ANYONE HAS HAD EXPERIENCE WITH XLIBRIS, OR CAN GIVE ME ANY INFORMATION, PLEASE CONTACT ME.

THANKS TO ALL.
MIKE PHELPS
copnovelist1@msn.com

[Viral]

You might find this helpful:

Also, go to the Search function and type in "xlibris" for more threads.

[brianm]

Welcome to AW. I urge you to read this thread from beginning to end.

Here are a couple quotes from our own Uncle Jim (James D. MacDonald). (http://www.sff.net/people/doylemacdonald/)

Random House makes it very plain that books published by Xlibris are not Random House books.

Bottom line for anyone considering Xlibris: They're a vanity POD.

If you truly wish to go this route, there are better and less expensive publishers to consider.

[Viral]

If you want to self-publish, I'd personally suggest www.lulu.com. They don't charge you to publish your book.

[kct webber]

:hi:

You should certainly look at the links above before doing anything.

[Birol]

Welcome to AW. We're very glad to have you here.

I'm going to move this thread from Newbies to the POD Self-publishing forum where you may get more targeted responses to your question.

[CCE]

I published a novel through Xlibris in 2001; the contract was drawn when they were still accepting manuscripts to publish with NO charge and they honored that even though it took forever to make the book available. When it first came out, it cost $14+.

As far as the "records showed, the LAST book sold in 2003. By then the prices were up to $18+. In March 2008 I bought a copy (to replace one I had in my files), I used a gift certificate so I bought it through the online resources just like a customer would. THAT SALE NEVER SHOWED ON THE ROYALTIES. In May 2008, someone I know went to order the book from Xlibris and was told it was no longer available even though I had been assured in March that it would remain available.

Xlibris NEVER responded to my queries aobut both of the above.

Long story short, I have since terminated my relationship with Xlibris and the book no longer shows on their website - supposedly they are having it removed from Amazon.com as well although it still shows as "not available".

My book is going to be republished next Spring by another publisher. More news to come on that.

[Editorinchic]

Wow. That's a mighty heavy package there. I know about that $12999 package they have... why not? I think you are not losing anything at all because Xlibris (http://www.xlibris.com/requestkit/index.asp?src=aop&key=frk) happens to be the only company that offers a money back guarantee.

[MacAllister]

Ah. Nice xlibris signature link, there, editorinchic. May we ask what your own association with them is?

[cpickett]

Hi Mike,
As others have advised, pleeeeze make sure your research is thorough. There are many other less expensive options out there both for fee-based publishers and going the independent route. Even if by chance money is not an issue for you, you want to make sure you get the best value whether you spend ten dollars or ten thousand.

Another thing to consider is marketing/promotional costs. If you end up deciding the 12k is a good deal, what do you have left to help promote? Because a book is out there and available through various outlets means next to nothing if no one knows about it and much of that task falls to you the author.

Welcome to the forum. It's a great thing that you are working to educate yourself.

[Editorinchic]

Ah. Nice xlibris signature link, there, editorinchic. May we ask what your own association with them is?

Hi. I happen to have a good friend of mine who published with them. So far, his accolades are reliable. :)

[Mac H.]

EditorInChic:

I'm going to be honest with you.

I don't believe you have been honest and ethical with us, when you claim that your connection with Xlibris is simply that you 'happen to have a good friend of mine who published with them.'

Let's look at the facts. In the past few weeks someone using the same user ID, credentials and photos as yourself has suddenly joined many, many communities. Every single post in those communities has had one affect - to tell people about Xlibris.

For example:

* You administer a message board for/on behalf of/about Xlibris.
Ref: http://www.shelfari.com/giannaroa

* You list books on your bookshelf as books you've read ... but every one seems to be an Xlibris book!
This looks exactly like a marketing push for Xlibris.
Ref: http://www.shelfari.com/giannaroa/shelf

* Since your sudden appearance on the web, every single entry seems to be telling people about Xlibiris.
I couldn't find a single reference to other POD solutions
eg: http://www.websitetoolbox.com/tool/post/cookcomm/vpost?id=2472534 That is inconceivable if you are interested in POD generally rather than being a shill for Xlibris !

Some of the attempts to introduce Xlibris into a conversation are pretty embarrassing.
eg: A question: "What would be the best way to make tickets for an event if I don't have Microsoft Publisher?" gets answered by you with a link to ... yep: Xlibris. If I didn't know better I'd suspect that someone did a search for all questions with the word 'Publisher' and decide to answer them all with a link to Xlibris!

*Your digg account has been used for one purpose only ... to promote Xlibris books.
Ref: http://digg.com/users/Editorinchic/history/diggs


Even your own blog (where every post promotes Xlibris) has some rather interesting 'facts' which are impossible to be true.

For example, on your blog you make two claims:
1. You state that you are 25/26 years old.
2. You state that you had been working for the same publisher as their Senior Editor for 13 years.

Ref: http://editorinchic.wordpress.com/2008/10/10/tongue-in-cheek/

That means that you became a senior editor at the age of 12 !??

Someone is telling porky pies. When telling untruths it is best to make sure that they are consistent.

(Some of your blog posts are even linking to 'Check out this interesting answer' on another site .. pretending that it isn't you who gave that interesting answer)

Even in this very thread you have been making statements which are blatantly false. (eg: 'Xlibris happens to be the only company that offers a money back guarantee' is not a truthful statement)

As you know, it is unethical to shill a company without making it clear that these are really advertisements for the company.

Of course, just because your posts are quacking like a duck and walking like a duck doesn't mean that it is 100% guaranteed that they are a small aquatic bird ... but it really looks like a highly unethical marketing push.

Is the entire of Xlibris marketing this unethical and dodgy? Is that the kind of service that Xlibris clients can expect?

Good luck,

Mac

[CaoPaux]

This just in...Author Solutions, parent of AuthorHouse and recent purchaser of iUniverse, has now bought Xlibris. Here's Writer Beware's take on the sale: http://accrispin.blogspot.com/2009/01/victoria-strauss-author-solutions.html

[WireHair]

Sometimes I see people on Yahoo Answers who say they have used Xlibris and giving vague info on publishing, linking to a bunch of Xlibris pages.

When viewing their profile, I am not sure if some of those accounts are used for anything besides posting in the Books & Authors section. They mostly answer questions about publishing. That leads me to believe that this company is spamming advertisements.

Can anything be done about this?

[MickRooney]

With the open envoirnment of the internet, I'm not sure there is a lot that can be done.

This is a common practice of some large POD publishers like Xlibris to spam to writers forums and create 'helpful' publishing blogs which ultimately serve the purpose of funneling authors to their companies services.

Again, it's a case of writer beware.

[katstoy]

I don't know how this company came to be known as the leading company in its industry, unless that nasty rumor was spread from within. Like so many people who have written from the heart and wish these words to be read, I too bought into that rumor and signed with Xlibris. What a nasty little experience this has turned out to be. I am not a young person though I am not old either. Being of middle age and having the background that I have with business administration, I should have done more research. The company or at least the people you are forced to deal with are not located in the United States and there is a language barrier or convient language barrier that dominates all communications with this company. I would not suggest that anyone invest $12,000 or more with this company on its word that there is a money back guarantee if unsatisfied because I am still trying to get a measly $1,599 back and having a very hard time getting it. Bad experiences: I paid for editing services and had to re-edit myself because what was returned to me was worse than what a 5th grader could have done. I paid for custom design of my book, from interior to exterior and when I submitted the designs the company's computer programming couldn't handle them. I gave a wonderful artist a great deal of money to come up with a beautiful picture for the cover of my book and three interior pictures and this company could not handle reproducing them. I paid for a publicity package and if you want to talk about a joke of misrepresentation, you should see what was sent to me. As a matter of fact, anyone who wants to see this trash, I have saved it all. No one at the company even bothered to read the book or skim its pages to come up with a meaningful representation of the story to pass on. I am having a hard time explaining how bad this publicity campaing was because it was so bad. Becareful what you put your trust in. Words may be pretty as they boast, but you need to have physical proof of the company's talents and successes before placing your heart in their hands. I know I can provide physical proof of Xlibris' screw ups.

[Wayne K]

EditorInChic:

I'm going to be honest with you.

I don't believe you have been honest and ethical with us, when you claim that your connection with Xlibris is simply that you 'happen to have a good friend of mine who published with them.'

Let's look at the facts. In the past few weeks someone using the same user ID, credentials and photos as yourself has suddenly joined many, many communities. Every single post in those communities has had one affect - to tell people about Xlibris.

For example:

* You administer a message board for/on behalf of/about Xlibris.
Ref: http://www.shelfari.com/giannaroa

* You list books on your bookshelf as books you've read ... but every one seems to be an Xlibris book!
This looks exactly like a marketing push for Xlibris.
Ref: http://www.shelfari.com/giannaroa/shelf

* Since your sudden appearance on the web, every single entry seems to be telling people about Xlibiris.
I couldn't find a single reference to other POD solutions
eg: http://www.websitetoolbox.com/tool/post/cookcomm/vpost?id=2472534 That is inconceivable if you are interested in POD generally rather than being a shill for Xlibris !

Some of the attempts to introduce Xlibris into a conversation are pretty embarrassing.
eg: A question: "What would be the best way to make tickets for an event if I don't have Microsoft Publisher?" gets answered by you with a link to ... yep: Xlibris. If I didn't know better I'd suspect that someone did a search for all questions with the word 'Publisher' and decide to answer them all with a link to Xlibris!

*Your digg account has been used for one purpose only ... to promote Xlibris books.
Ref: http://digg.com/users/Editorinchic/history/diggs


Even your own blog (where every post promotes Xlibris) has some rather interesting 'facts' which are impossible to be true.

For example, on your blog you make two claims:
1. You state that you are 25/26 years old.
2. You state that you had been working for the same publisher as their Senior Editor for 13 years.

Ref: http://editorinchic.wordpress.com/2008/10/10/tongue-in-cheek/

That means that you became a senior editor at the age of 12 !??

Someone is telling porky pies. When telling untruths it is best to make sure that they are consistent.

(Some of your blog posts are even linking to 'Check out this interesting answer' on another site .. pretending that it isn't you who gave that interesting answer)

Even in this very thread you have been making statements which are blatantly false. (eg: 'Xlibris happens to be the only company that offers a money back guarantee' is not a truthful statement)

As you know, it is unethical to shill a company without making it clear that these are really advertisements for the company.

Of course, just because your posts are quacking like a duck and walking like a duck doesn't mean that it is 100% guaranteed that they are a small aquatic bird ... but it really looks like a highly unethical marketing push.

Is the entire of Xlibris marketing this unethical and dodgy? Is that the kind of service that Xlibris clients can expect?

Good luck,

Mac

Remind me not to lie to you.

[MickRooney]

I don't know how this company came to be known as the leading company in its industry, unless that nasty rumor was spread from within.

Likewise, Katstoy, I've certainly no idea where the grand title of leading company in the industry came from. While like sister company AuthorHouse, they may be tops of the pile in popularity - any self-publishing author who looks closely at what they have to offer and for how much will relegate them down the pile.

[KTC]

I don't know how this company came to be known as the leading company in its industry, unless that nasty rumor was spread from within. Like so many people who have written from the heart and wish these words to be read, I too bought into that rumor and signed with Xlibris. What a nasty little experience this has turned out to be. I am not a young person though I am not old either. Being of middle age and having the background that I have with business administration, I should have done more research. The company or at least the people you are forced to deal with are not located in the United States and there is a language barrier or convient language barrier that dominates all communications with this company. I would not suggest that anyone invest $12,000 or more with this company on its word that there is a money back guarantee if unsatisfied because I am still trying to get a measly $1,599 back and having a very hard time getting it. Bad experiences: I paid for editing services and had to re-edit myself because what was returned to me was worse than what a 5th grader could have done. I paid for custom design of my book, from interior to exterior and when I submitted the designs the company's computer programming couldn't handle them. I gave a wonderful artist a great deal of money to come up with a beautiful picture for the cover of my book and three interior pictures and this company could not handle reproducing them. I paid for a publicity package and if you want to talk about a joke of misrepresentation, you should see what was sent to me. As a matter of fact, anyone who wants to see this trash, I have saved it all. No one at the company even bothered to read the book or skim its pages to come up with a meaningful representation of the story to pass on. I am having a hard time explaining how bad this publicity campaing was because it was so bad. Becareful what you put your trust in. Words may be pretty as they boast, but you need to have physical proof of the company's talents and successes before placing your heart in their hands. I know I can provide physical proof of Xlibris' screw ups.


I'm sorry you got burned. Welcome to AW. You can use the Share Your Work forums here to get honest and free opinions and critiques from fellow writers. For free.

[KTC]

Remind me not to lie to you.


I know this is an old thread--restarted today by a victim--but I have to agree with you, Wayne. Mac...that is impressive. I was jumping up and down with excitement as I read your post. Wow!

[mscelina]

Damn. Amen.

*whew!*

That laundry list is Robovowels-worthy.

[katstoy]

I am currently dealing with someone who I believe to be a trustworty individual while trying to get my money back. He is located here in the U.S. and I contacted him last evening after being hungup on by those "Customer Satisfation" representatives in the Phillipines three times yesterday afternoon. The shell game these companies play is unbelievable. I had a very hard time finding the person I eventually contacted. I don't know what my legal rights are, but now that I have my credit card company involved there will be an investigation at my say so. I am giving this one last try because I really hate the feeling of misturst that I have now and want my life back along with my trust. It would be a good step for the newest proud parent company of this dark horse to just give the money back thereby lending this industry some semblance of credibility.

[Mac H.]

Remind me not to lie to you.You don't know the best bit.

See those photos of 'EditorInChic' ?

They are photos taken from the website of a girl in the Philippines.
She has a blog about shopping, dating, time with friends, etc.

And somehow her photo is identical to that of a XLibris shill.

I exchanged some emails with the girl in the Philippines and she confirmed that 'EditorInChic' isn't her.

Mac
(PS: I'm not linking to the original source of the pictures out of courtesy. She just wants to ignore it and enjoy her life and her blog - it isn't her fault that someone dishonest is pretending to be her)

[StephenJSweeney]

Oops! Please excuse the shouting - I didn't notice how old this thread was and that it had recently been bumped :)

[ResearchGuy]

I don't know how this company came to be known as the leading company in its industry. . .
The pertinent industry is "subsidy publishing." It is a prominent subsidy publisher. That is an entirely different animal from commercial publisher, one that directs its books toward readers and that pays the authors rather than that directs its books toward their own authors and is paid by the authors.

--Ken

[CaoPaux]

An example of AS's "press release" service (and the attention it will net you from editors so spammed): http://nihilistic-kid.livejournal.com/1408441.html

[matdonna]

Xlibris is now targeting writers on Facebook. If you are on Facebook and have objections to Xlibris, let Facebook know when you see the ads by clicking the 'x' to 'report this ad'.

[MickRooney]

Xlibris is now targeting writers on Facebook. If you are on Facebook and have objections to Xlibris, let Facebook know when you see the ads by clicking the 'x' to 'report this ad'.

Donna,

Do you mean Xlibris are messaging authors directly on Facebook or just using their advert space?

If its the latter then I'm not sure quite why you're asking people to 'report this ad'. You may not like/agree with the services they sell, but like many online social networks, adspace is offered to companies selling services and products.

In fact, I think Twitter is planning something similar.

[matdonna]

Just turning up as an ad, Mick. On my profile page. I'm not asking people to 'report', just suggesting they do so -if- they don't like seeing these particular ads themselves, or if, like some of the posters on this thread, they have complaints or objections to XLibris. The same would go for any company you don't want to support. I particularly dislike the way various subsidy or vanity publishers target their ads to people on FB who list writing as an interest. When I feel I want to report one, it's usually because I find the ads or the copy at their company website 'misleading', which is one of the options for reporting a FB ad.

Don't worry about FB not being able to meet their expenses... they will replace the ads you object to with something else they think you or your friends will be interested in....:-)

[ResearchGuy]

... When I feel I want to report one, it's usually because I find the ads or the copy at their company website 'misleading', which is one of the options for reporting a FB ad....
Or you could just ignore them as just so much Web background noise. That's what I do.

--Ken

[Tsu Dho Nimh]

And XLIBRIS gets another one. I left a comment, gently icking on his wow, if it does any good.

http://www.glendalestar.com/features/feature_stories/article_f53213c4-d63e-11df-967a-001cc4c03286.html

[Jamiekswriter]

I had considered having Xlibris publish a poetry book of mine back when I was doing poetry slams. My thought was I'd print up 50 copies and have my husband at a card table with them and if people liked my stuff, they could buy the book from us.

It turned out Xlibris (at the time - I haven't looked a them recently) couldn't print the book for me. The page count I needed was too small. And they couldn't work around my formatting. (I wanted to used my own photos on opposite pages -- again this might have changed). No biggie. In retrospect, I probably would have lost money had things gone through. The cost I would have to sell them at being prohibitive to what the slam crowd would be willing to pay.

Anywho, they called me once a month for over three years, offering to publish my book. The first time they called, I spoke to a telemarketer and told them that they *couldn't* publish it because it doesn't fit their formatting needs. The rest of the time I let them eat answering machine tape. Every now and then I get a mailing from them too.

If I were to consider self publishing again, I'd probably be more inclined to LULU and/or Amazon's CreateSpace rather than Xlbris because of the sheer asshattery they've been involved in.

[MumblingSage]

And XLIBRIS gets another one. I left a comment, gently icking on his wow, if it does any good.

http://www.glendalestar.com/features/feature_stories/article_f53213c4-d63e-11df-967a-001cc4c03286.html

:'( I hope it does some good. Scams and dishonesty always get me hot under the collar, but what really saddens me is when they take in young people like this kid (maybe I shouldn't call him that, he's only 2 years younger than me). It might be the fact that we're so close in age that makes me feel for him. I hope this cruddy experience doesn't turn him off to writing and publishing entirely.

[grandpa norm]

i am in contact with xlibra publishing any one know any thing about them?? they make it sound very good for a newbee thanks norm wilson

[James D. Macdonald]

i am in contact with xlibra publishing any one know any thing about them?? they make it sound very good for a newbee thanks norm wilson


Do I know anything about them?

They're a vanity press.

If you want total strangers to read your book, they're a terrible idea.
If you're planning to make money from your writing, they're a terrible idea.

If all you want is to hold a copy of your book in your hand, there are cheaper ways to go about it.

Yes, they make it sound very good. Used car salesmen can make a lemon that needs a new transmission, a ring job, a head gasket, and $5,000 worth of body work sound good too.

The chief promise of a vanity press is, "We'll publish your book even if it isn't ready."

Please see:
This is nothing like an official FAQ (http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=58205)

[ResearchGuy]

i am in contact with xlibra publishing any one know any thing about them?? they make it sound very good for a newbee thanks norm wilson
Read the booklet linked in my sig. block. It has information you will find helpful, including a list of resources with much more information.

Any choice can be ok as long as you know what you are getting, costs and benefits, whether it would meet your objectives, what the alternatives are (and whether and how they would meet your objectives and their costs and benefits), and why you are making that particular choice. In general, though, any publisher that solicits you to "become a published author," or any variation on that, is probably a bad idea. That solicitation involves deception, which is the heart of the vanity press model. But an eyes-wide open, well-informed choice to use a subsidy (pay-to-play) publisher is a choice an author is entitled to make. But success stories under that model are at best rare. (Of course, much depends on the author's definition of success.)

--Ken

[Danny Marcus]

Hi All

I was wondering whether anybody has had experience with Xlibris? They are apparently a self publishing organisation.

I would appreciate any comments (useful of course!)

Thanks

Danny

[poetinahat]

Searching for the publisher name in thread titles gave me this result:

http://absolutewrite.com/forums/search.php?searchid=21056050

There are already two threads relating to this publisher:

<snipped>
Authorhouse, iUniverse and Xlibris all merged now (http://absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?t=128539)

In future, try the Search function to see if your question's already been answered.

I hope this information helps.

[James D. Macdonald]

They are apparently a self publishing organisation.


No, they are a vanity press.

Avoid them.

[LilGreenBookworm]

I know the thread is old, but I wanted to comment anyway. Somehow, xlibris got my phone number (I do NOT put that info online, anywhere) and just called offering to publish my book. My phone cut off the gentleman who called, and as I waited for him to call back I came here to check out the company.

Thank you so much, people of AW, for posting this thread and not letting me make a huge mistake. Hugs all around!