Time to party like it's 1984...

[robeiae]

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/opinion/op_ed/view.bg?articleid=1035832#articleFull

From the oped:

They’re your kids, and they’re the National Security Agency of the Nanny State.

I found this out after my 13-year-old daughter’s annual checkup. Her pediatrician grilled her about alcohol and drug abuse.

Not my daughter’s boozing. Mine.

“The doctor wanted to know how much you and mom drink, and if I think it’s too much,” my daughter told us afterward, rolling her eyes in that exasperated 13-year-old way. “She asked if you two did drugs, or if there are drugs in the house.”

“What!” I yelped. “Who told her about my stasher, I mean, ‘It’s an outrage!’ ”

I turned to my wife. “You took her to the doctor. Why didn’t you say something?”

She couldn’t, she told me, because she knew nothing about it. All these questions were asked in private, without my wife’s knowledge or consent.

"Who denounced you?" said Winston.

"It was my little daughter," said Parsons..."I don't bear her any grudge fot it. In fact, I'm proud of her."

And just think, when we have universal health care, this can be a universal policy. After all, who will the doctors will be working for...

[Susan Gable]

I've heard of doctors also asking kids if there are guns in their homes.

I'm training my kid that he has the right to remain silent. <G> Or to say, "None of your damn business. Now about that pain in my side..."

Susan G.

[Tracy]

That is so incredibly scary. 1984 - too right.

Are parents not allowed in to the doctor's surgery with their children? AFIK, here, the parent would always be with a minor child, unless it was surgery of course, in which case the child wouldn't be asking any questions.

[TheGaffer]

The editorial is engaging in a bit of fear-mongering (as are you, rob, considering I don't know anyone who is proposing such a national plan), but a policy that allows doctors to question children about their parents' habits is one I don't think many people support -- I certainly don't -- with the exception of a case where a child has undocumented injuries/signs of abuse. It is overreaching, and wrong, and I'd get a new doctor as well if it were my kid.

[robeiae]

Fear-mongering? Sure.

But it's something to fear, no? And this type of thing will not come all at once, but by slow machinations.

So...I am afraid. Truly.

[PattiTheWicked]

While I dont' think it's okay to turn our kids into giant tattletales and grill them about parent's personal habits without the parents in the room, I also think a doctor should be able to ask a child if they feel safe in their own home. If there's no indication that the child is abused, afraid or neglected, there's absolutely no reason to ask any of these questions.

[RumpleTumbler]

Buy me that bicycle or I'll tell the doctor you do drugs.

[TheGaffer]

And this type of thing will not come all at once, but by slow machinations.

That much is true. It's sort of like making torture law of the land.

[robeiae]

I'm against that, too. But perspective is important, imo. Why is torture such a great fear, but stuff like this is not?

[Haggis]

Holy crap. I wouldn't have believed it.

[Joe270]

This reminds me of a couple books I read . . .

Fahrenhiet 451.

It Can't Happen Here.

[Stew21]

When I took my little one to ER last week, the RN was asking the typical "registration" (address, insurance, what did you give him, to reduce the fever, what time, la-dee-da) questions and one of the last ones was "do you have any reason to believe the child isn't safe in the home?"
NO! I don't. um? he's here for a fever.
Standard question, Mrs. Stew.
err. ok.



So let me get this straight, eventually instead of asking me a question like that they are going to ask my children?

[wordmonkey]

And just think, when we have universal health care, this can be a universal policy. After all, who will the doctors will be working for...

Dude. You can do better than that. I enjoy a spirited game of bait the liberal/conservative as much as the next guy, but this one kinda lacked the usual finese I'd expect from you.

Need coffee?

[robeiae]

Dude. You can do better than that. I enjoy a spirited game of bait the liberal/conservative as much as the next guy, but this one kinda lacked the usual finese I'd expect from you.

Need coffee?No. Why would I want to finesse something about to be rammed down my throat?

[William Haskins]

Dude. You can do better than that. I enjoy a spirited game of bait the liberal/conservative as much as the next guy, but this one kinda lacked the usual finese I'd expect from you.

Need coffee?

actually, it brings up a valid point about some considerations that should be made as many in the US pursue universal healthcare.

privacy and lifestyle issues are increasingly becoming issues with such plans.

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23410977-details/'NHS%20should%20not%20treat%20those%20with%20unhea lthy%20lifestyles'%20say%20Tories/article.do?expand=true

[TheGaffer]

No. Why would I want to finesse something about to be rammed down my throat?

Lemme ask, b/c I haven't looked.

A number of the major Democratic candidates have proposed health care plans. Do any of them address this? Most of them as far as I can tell look to some kind of private/public hybrid, recognizing that breaking down and starting over just isn't possible.

I'm curious if any address privacy concerns and I'm going to try to look into this.

[Bartholomew]

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f332/blackout_entertainment/OrwellFlag.jpg

[ColoradoGuy]

The interesting thing about many of those intrusive questions is that they are actually mandated by a body called the Joint Commission on Accreditation of Hospitals. Now, JCAHO is a private organization, accountable to no one, and in theory participation in the certification process is voluntary. However, all hospitals must get the certification because without it insurance companies, as well as Medicare and Medicaid, will not pay you. So it's not the government. In a sense, the issue has been outsourced to a totally unaccountable organization that sets any standards it likes. I would much prefer an actual federal standard to random JCAHO ones. I've suffered through quite a few JCAHO "visits" (read inquisitions) over the years, and they can be quite bizarre.

[C.bronco]

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/opinion/op_ed/view.bg?articleid=1035832#articleFull

From the oped:

"Who denounced you?" said Winston.

"It was my little daughter," said Parsons..."I don't bear her any grudge fot it. In fact, I'm proud of her."

And just think, when we have universal health care, this can be a universal policy. After all, who will the doctors will be working for...
Robeiae, my next running mate. We could have our campaign ready for 2012.
Raise your hand if you are shocked that this started in Massachusetts.

[Roger J Carlson]

The interesting thing about many of those intrusive questions is that they are actually mandated by a body called the Joint Commission on Accreditation of Hospitals. Now, JCAHO is a private organization, accountable to no one, and in theory participation in the certification process is voluntary. However, all hospitals must get the certification because without it insurance companies, as well as Medicare and Medicaid, will not pay you. So it's not the government. In a sense, the issue has been outsourced to a totally unaccountable organization that sets any standards it likes. I would much prefer an actual federal standard to random JCAHO ones. I've suffered through quite a few JCAHO "visits" (read inquisitions) over the years, and they can be quite bizarre.JCAHO visits used to be scheduled. Now they're surprise visits. Much like an FBI raid. ;)

[RumpleTumbler]

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f332/blackout_entertainment/OrwellFlag.jpg

All perfectly valid and great points! I like that eye too.

[Voyager]

This is ridiculous and scary. At what age are they allowed to begin this interrogation? Can a five-year old really gauge how much mom or dad drink or whether or not they fight 'too much'? My husband and I don't drink, smoke or do drugs and yet this made my gut lurch. I can imagine how parents who have the occasional cocktail or beer might have concerns over their very young child's perception of frequency and/or quantity. A perfect example. When my son was six, he had this conversation with his grandmother while watching television.

Son: Mom gives us drugs sometimes
Grandma: What?
Son: Yeah, especially on Sundays when we've been good.
Grandma: What???
Son: They're so good, I love my mom.
Grandma: WHAT???

Turns out that he had just seen one of those, this is your brain, this is your brain on drugs, commercials with the fried egg. At six, he assumed that drugs was a metaphor for eggs. If my child had repeated this upon being grilled by his physician, I might have been investigated and now have a record with Child Protective Services that, regardless of the outcome of said investigation, would never be expunged. Something is very very wrong, and I agree, rather Orwellian about this whole thing.

[dmytryp]

Buy me that bicycle or I'll tell the doctor you do drugs.

This is really not funny, but the kids already have that power, no?

'Buy me a bicycle, or I'll tell the police you beat me up.'

[Roger J Carlson]

Buy me that bicycle or I'll tell the doctor you do drugs.My wife is a first-grade teacher. One of her colleagues was threatened by a first-grader. He told her he was going tell the school office she was abusing him. It happens.

[TheGaffer]

Turns out that he had just seen one of those, this is your brain, this is your brain on drugs, commercials with the fried egg. At six, he assumed that drugs was a metaphor for eggs.

Nice anecdote, actually. And completely in line with things children say.

[Celia Cyanide]

Son: Mom gives us drugs sometimes
Grandma: What?
Son: Yeah, especially on Sundays when we've been good.
Grandma: What???
Son: They're so good, I love my mom.
Grandma: WHAT???


Holy crap! This is too funny! The poor kid thought he had learned a new vocabulary word! Like kids who learn to spell "relief" R-O-L-A-I-D-S.

[benbradley]

This is ridiculous and scary. At what age are they allowed to begin this interrogation? Can a five-year old really gauge how much mom or dad drink or whether or not they fight 'too much'? My husband and I don't drink, smoke or do drugs and yet this made my gut lurch. I can imagine how parents who have the occasional cocktail or beer might have concerns over their very young child's perception of frequency and/or quantity. A perfect example. When my son was six, he had this conversation with his grandmother while watching television.

Son: Mom gives us drugs sometimes
Grandma: What?
Son: Yeah, especially on Sundays when we've been good.
Grandma: What???
Son: They're so good, I love my mom.
Grandma: WHAT???

Turns out that he had just seen one of those, this is your brain, this is your brain on drugs, commercials with the fried egg. At six, he assumed that drugs was a metaphor for eggs. If my child had repeated this upon being grilled by his physician, I might have been investigated and now have a record with Child Protective Services that, regardless of the outcome of said investigation, would never be expunged. Something is very very wrong, and I agree, rather Orwellian about this whole thing.
There's a good bit of "guilty unless proven innocent" in the way illegal drug use is handled by the police and courts (and apparently with CPS too, using a simple four-word argument: "Think of the children!"). Much of this is a result of "the war on drugs" expressing the idea that illegal drugs are so bad that they should be stopped at any cost.

But there's even more scary parts to this: Do you know what the most common treatment is for drug and alcohol addiction?

[RumpleTumbler]

That's easy. Drugs.

[TheGaffer]

But there's even more scary parts to this: Do you know what the most common treatment is for drug and alcohol addiction?


They shove a living snake up your ass?

[Bird of Prey]

There's a good bit of "guilty unless proven innocent" in the way illegal drug use is handled by the police and courts (and apparently with CPS too, using a simple four-word argument: "Think of the children!"). Much of this is a result of "the war on drugs" expressing the idea that illegal drugs are so bad that they should be stopped at any cost.

But there's even more scary parts to this: Do you know what the most common treatment is for drug and alcohol addiction?

Exorcism.

[Joe270]

Revulsion therapy?

[Haggis]

Faith-based 12 step programs.

[Joe270]

Explosives?

I mean, you gotta get that snake out somehow.

[Roger J Carlson]

Prison.

[benbradley]

Exorcism.
Not quite, but you're on the right track...
Faith-based 12 step programs.
No more entries, folks we have a winner!
Prison.
That's for those who refuse to do faith-based 12 step programs (the deal is part of probation - if you don't go to meetings, you're going against your probation requirements, so THEN you go to prison), aka those who are "in denial" and "refusing treatment." One can then shorten one's time in prison, getting "good behavior" points, by attending faith-based 12-step programs held in prison.

And I'm reminded (I first saw this story elsewhere a few days ago) that this sort of thing (children being asked to snitch on their parents) has been going on for a while - I recall at least one previous story of pediatricians asking children about parents' gun ownership. I just found this from a year ago, a Virginia state bill that would ban doctors from asking children about parents' gun ownership:
http://content.hamptonroads.com/story.cfm?story=100053&ran=103354&tref=po

Another story from recent years (I can't find it offhand) told of a school program against drugs - the children were told "If your parents use drugs, tell us and we'll get help for them." One child told on his father, then was very upset because his father was ARRESTED rather than "helped."