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Bird of Prey

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I just find such a wonderful irony in it all. I mean here the US Senate passes some ineffectual statement advocating the partitioning of Iraq, as if it's not even a sovereign country.

LOL!! Well thank you, finally, for the acknowledgement!! It's NOT Iraq anymore; it's. . .ours!!
 

Higgins

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I just find such a wonderful irony in it all. I mean here the US Senate passes some ineffectual statement advocating the partitioning of Iraq, as if it's not even a sovereign country.

LOL!! Well thank you, finally, for the acknowledgement!! It's NOT Iraq anymore; it's. . .ours!!


Since some kind of partitioning has been going on since 1991 (enforced by no-fly zones), Biden was just trying to solidify a sensible objective. After all its not like the Kurds and Shia and a lot of Sunnis would not like to run their own local affairs. And the USA is partitioned into 50 states and we seem to like that.
 

Bird of Prey

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It takes a Neocon steal a nation.

But since we've got it, I guess Joe's just trying to fit into the decor.
 

Bird of Prey

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Since some kind of partitioning has been going on since 1991 (enforced by no-fly zones), Biden was just trying to solidify a sensible objective. After all its not like the Kurds and Shia and a lot of Sunnis would not like to run their own local affairs. And the USA is partitioned into 50 states and we seem to like that.

Yes, WE do seem to like that, Sokal. So the Iraqis better like that too or they damn well may wind up the fifty-first state.

Wait.


Maybe that was the plan. . . .
 

RumpleTumbler

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If they aren't racists they'll vote Cynthia McKinney into power in the most important area.
 

Higgins

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Yes, WE do seem to like that, Sokal. So the Iraqis better like that too or they damn well may wind up the fifty-first state.

Wait.


Maybe that was the plan. . . .

No that was Morroco. They suggested that they might like to be the 47th state (in 1906, I believe) rather than be partitioned by Spain, France, Germany, Chad, Mali and Sierra Bueno.

You keep forgetting that the majority of Iraqis apparently want some kind of de facto partitioning right now (ie the Kurds definitely do and the Shia mostly do and even some Sunnis probably do). Note that the Kurds are already making their own oil contracts and the Shia seem to have gotten Iran to cool its hyperactive approach.
 

Bird of Prey

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No that was Morroco. They suggested that they might like to be the 47th state (in 1906, I believe) rather than be partitioned by Spain, France, Germany, Chad, Mali and Sierra Bueno.

You keep forgetting that the majority of Iraqis apparently want some kind of de facto partitioning right now (ie the Kurds definitely do and the Shia mostly do and even some Sunnis probably do). Note that the Kurds are already making their own oil contracts and the Shia seem to have gotten Iran to cool its hyperactive approach.

Sokal - I'm all for whatever they want to do, as long as it's them, not us, doing their bidding.
 

William Haskins

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Sokal - I'm all for whatever they want to do, as long as it's them, not us, doing their bidding.

yes, if america wants them partitioned to end the violence there and bring a large portion of our troops home, that's just more evil imperialism.

but if they want to stay integrated and keep blowing up schoolkids and schoolteachers and mosques and police stations and hospitals, well, who the fuck are we to tell them what to do?
 

Higgins

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yes, if america wants them partitioned to end the violence there and bring a large portion of our troops home, that's just more evil imperialism.

but if they want to stay integrated and keep blowing up schoolkids and schoolteachers and mosques and police stations and hospitals, well, who the fuck are we to tell them what to do?

But it's the other way around: the vast majority of Kurds and Shia and no doubt Iran all would like partitioning to gain control and autonomy in their regions, some Sunnis and some Shia in the central government and the USA all officially claim partitioning would be bad. It's not a problem of Imperialism, its a problem with the US occupation becoming only marginally relevent, so that (ironically) as more hysterical chestbeating and heartbleeding happens in the US, everybody in Iraq sympathizes but realizes they are watching a spectacle that has little to do with how they are going to run things in their autonomous regions.
And there's an additional paradox: if the US really is fighting El-Q and the locals are on the side of the US, then the "War" is just a bunch of bloody stunts that never has had any real effect on the politics of partitioning, which is why it looks like the central government is doing nothing: its not their war, even if the US and EL-Q insist on having it in Iraq.
Apparently the US and El-Q will have to stay there and fight each other forever...like a really bad Star Trek episode, or a cheap Hell for the politically dim.
 

Bird of Prey

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yes, if america wants them partitioned to end the violence there and bring a large portion of our troops home, that's just more evil imperialism.

but if they want to stay integrated and keep blowing up schoolkids and schoolteachers and mosques and police stations and hospitals, well, who the fuck are we to tell them what to do?

You're workin kinda hard today. Wasn't last night your wedding night? What's the matter? The thrill's gone already?

Look, do we own Iraq or not? Yes or no.

Because here's the situation: by the US Senate voting what will be in Iraq sends a very strong message to the Middle East in general, and it's not good. It is an acknowledgement of more than our occupation; it is an acknowledgement of our rule. Do you see the difference? And it's an embarrassment to the Iraq central government and weakens it to the point that it might as well be dissolved. It also confirms the fact that our government is capricious, that stay the course only applies to us, meaning our interests.

If you want a partitioned Iraq, the least we could do is let it come out of the mouth of the puppet government WE set up. But what's obvious to me is that ever since Iraq cut a deal with Iran, well, we don't like the status quo so much anymore.

And that deal btw, may be the reason for a lot less problems there. . . actually, a few less problems would be more accurate.
 
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Higgins

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If you want a partitioned Iraq, the least we could do is let it come out of the mouth of the puppet government WE set up. But what's obvious to me is that ever since the Iraq cut a deal with Iran, well, we don't like the status quo so much anymore.

That and the mysterious "Shia stand-down" about a month ago when all the Shia militias ceased operating for a period.

The surge worked. Now the place can be left to partition itself de facto no matter what the US does, though it looks like we will end up backing the Sunni (oops they just spent the last 4 years killing us) and the Kurds (who are in trouble with everybody on earth except the good old USA) while the Iranians back the Shia. Which means about 10 Brigades until the oil runs out in about 2055.