Somebody peed in my wheaties

[Andre_Laurent]

And that somebody is JR Ward. I just recently learned of the existance of JR Ward as it was recommended that I had better read her book called Dark Lover. In which I find a scene involving horse tranking a vampire and dragging him off to be tortured and then even worse, a major character who is a cop.

Now guess what. I have a scene where a vampire is horse tranked and dragged off to be tortured AND a major character who is a cop. So I am left scratching my ***. I feel like I need to give my character a different career but that throws a wrench in the works. Oh what to do, what to do.... hand fulls of hair being yanked out over this.

Oh and I'm not done reading that damn book... wondering what else I'm going to find before I hit the last page.

What do I do about the cop????

[PeeDee]

If I had to count all the novels that have a major character who is a cop, I would be counting from now 'till the stars burn cold.

On the other hand, I've never said "Oh, great, ANOTHER major character who's a cop! Gawd!" So you're probably okay having a cop.

You're on your own with the tranquilized vampire, though.

[Haggis]

And here I thought this was another thread about Spooky.

Bummer, Andre. I hope you're not too far along in the project that your rewrite will have to be uber time consuming.

[Carrie in PA]

Well, that's frustrating. Maybe make him a detective or some other rank? Military police? CSI? :)

Use elephant tranquilizer instead. Way cooler than horse stuff. :)

[LeeFlower]

I'm fairly certain the whole "tranking and torturing the vamp" thing is standard fare.

They torture Angel on Buffy, and I'll eat cherry-flavored snow, freshly fallen, off my porch before a World of Darkness game involving vampires goes without some sort of torturing.

I think you're fine. Just do something new with it, so it's not the same old.

[WackAMole]

Or you could always go with some other obscure type trank. There are some really cool meds out there just for writers to exploit heh

[aadams73]

Don't sweat it. Chances are your style of writing is dramatically different to hers.

[Andre_Laurent]

If I had to count all the novels that have a major character who is a cop, I would be counting from now 'till the stars burn cold.

On the other hand, I've never said "Oh, great, ANOTHER major character who's a cop! Gawd!" So you're probably okay having a cop.

You're on your own with the tranquilized vampire, though.
Yeah, BUT... JR Ward's book: cop and vampire meet when vampire is skulking around girl's place and cop sees him and tries to arrest vampire.

My WIP: cop and vampire meet when vampire is skulking around girl's place and cop sees him and tries to arrest vampire.

Then it goes in different directions. Her book, vampire almost kills cop.
My WIP vampire makes cop look like an *** and vampire gets out of Dodge.

You see where I could be a bit p*ssed off over this.

[Tallymark]

Oh, god, I know exactly how you feel--I just got through plotting a vampire paranormal romance novel involving vampires convening in alaska (because of the prolonged night). I was just doing some last research, when I decided to look up Barrow, the northernmost part of Alaska, as a potential setting. Wikipedia mentioned that a there's a horror comic called 30 Days of Night set in Barrow, Alaska. "Oh no," I go, and follow the link...and lo and behold. A horror comic series about vampires convening in Alaska during the extended night. WORSE--its about to be made into a movie! Yeah, its a horror comic, while mine was planned as a romance, but still--the base premise that gets the characters where they need to be is the same. I'd certainly never get it published before the movie, so even if it did get published, everyone who saw it would go "Oh, just like that movie"--and because of that, it surely wouldn't get published.

I know its not quite the same--I'm not nearly as far into the writing process--but I've been nursing this baby for ages, and I'd finally gotten all the kinks worked out, and now its gone. Pretty much all of the subplots (ie, everything but the romance) had revolved around that base premise, and now I don't think I can use it, and I'd have to change so much of the plot to get around that that I don't know if anything can be saved. I'm absolutely heartbroken.

So yeah, someone peed in my wheaties too. ;_;

[PeeDee]

30 Days of Night is a wonderful comic book. Steve Niles is a great writer.

Honestly, this is why I haven't bothered writing anything in particular with vampires, except for one short story about a nice old vampire who was squeamish, and didn't want to actually be a bother by biting someone.

[James D. Macdonald]

Oh what to do, what to do.... hand fulls of hair being yanked out over this.

This really is an easy question.

Write your book. Finish it. Send it out. Write another one.

[Andre_Laurent]

Well, that's frustrating. Maybe make him a detective or some other rank? Military police? CSI? :)

Use elephant tranquilizer instead. Way cooler than horse stuff. :)
The vampire was a detective before he got "vampired" so I can't use that for the cop.

[Andre_Laurent]

This really is an easy question.

Write your book. Finish it. Send it out. Write another one.
Yeah but if I don't change some of the similar cop/vampire stuff I just know (assuming I actually get it published some day) I'll be accused of "borrowing" from Ward.

[soloset]

Oh, god, I know exactly how you feel--I just got through plotting a vampire paranormal romance novel involving vampires convening in alaska (because of the prolonged night).

Okay, I think I'm owed royalties, because I thought this up at least fifteen years ago. I didn't write it down or anything, but I made firm plans, should I ever become a vampire, to move to Alaska because of the sunlight thing.

There are LOTS of books that, boiled down to a gimmick and a few characters, would be pretty darn identical. What's important is the style you put into it, and if you really care about the book that'll shine through.

By the time your book is finished, edited, re-edited, submitted, accepted, re-re-edited, and published, it'll be a moot point anyway, with the possible exception of extra advertising as people who like the other author's stuff eagerly gobble yours up too.

ETA: (Forgot to add that I, for one, will happily read the other author now and you at a later date, no problem. My bookshelf is plenty big enough for two or three more books involving cops and vampire torture.)

[James D. Macdonald]

By the time you get to the second or third draft they may have vanished all by themselves.

Concentrate on the parts that are unique to you: your voice, your worldview, your themes.

Listen: I've had one of my novels criticized on the basis that it was "obviously copied" from a novel that I'd never read or even heard of. So what? If nothing else, finishing this book will give you more practice in finishing books, and will get more of the million words out of the way.

[imagoodgurl4]

The title of this thread cracked me up. I'm seriously gonna throw that into conversation the next time I'm mad. "Why'd he have to go and do something like pee in my wheaties?" Okay, sorry, I couldn't resist.

Anyway, back on topic. I've had that happen to me numerous times. I'll write a scene and then I'll read a book and find a similar scene to mine. And I'm always thinking, "Crap. This guy's famous and published....so if I keep this scene someone's gonna think I plagarized." It's very frustrating.

[Andre_Laurent]

The title of this thread cracked me up. I'm seriously gonna throw that into conversation the next time I'm mad. "Why'd he have to go and do something like pee in my wheaties?" Okay, sorry, I couldn't resist.

Anyway, back on topic. I've had that happen to me numerous times. I'll write a scene and then I'll read a book and find a similar scene to mine. And I'm always thinking, "Crap. This guy's famous and published....so if I keep this scene someone's gonna think I plagarized." It's very frustrating.
Glad you liked it. :D I'm off to find a new trank... I wonder what they use to drop tigers with.

[David McAfee]

Glad you liked it. :D I'm off to find a new trank... I wonder what they use to drop tigers with.

tiger trank? :) (couldn't resist)

[Andre_Laurent]

tiger trank? :) (couldn't resist)
Ketamine and Valium cocktail. :D

[MattW]

I am by no means a pharmacokinetic expert, but what about some kind of easily available drug that alters blood chemistry that would act as a vamp seditive? Aspirin, iron, dopes allegedly used in cycle racing.

Depends on how your vampires internals operate.

[Tallymark]

Darn, I guess I'm not as original as I thought. ^_^; Ah well, I guess its an important thing to come to realize that everything has been done before, one way or another--whats important is making your own way different. Maybe I'll try giving it another shot after all, even though my plot was really very similar in some respects--if I let the characters have free reign maybe they can salvage it for me. It's just extremely disheartening (and intimidating) though to find that your idea has not only been done, but been done by a big name in the field--like JR Ward or Steve Niles. Even if your work is very different, its hard to get people--or editors--to know that at a glance.

Its sorta like how after Harry Potter it'd be pretty hard to write about a wizards school--but when I was a kid, I'd read five or six books about wizarding schools. And all of them were totally different from Harry Potter. So it can be done--its just now, one has to work a bit harder to be different enough to get out from the other persons shadow. maybe the extra work is a good thing though (but a stressful thing nonetheless XD ).

Anyway, I would agree that having a cop character isn't so bad, since they're pretty common. And the trank doesn't sound so bad either simply because its a logical move--its hard to subdue a vampire! ^_^; If the shooter knows the guys' a vampire I'd suggest something like liquid garlic or a vial of holy water, but I'm guessing thats not the case.

I don't know how on earth they'd get hold of tiger (or maybe elephant!) tranks, but I think it'd be highly entertaining to see. :D

[sammyig]

Maybe the cop could have a girlfriend who works at the local zoo

[greglondon]

I have a feeling that eating breakfast will be a slightly off-putting experience for a while. Or maybe it's time to give up the wheeties for something else.

[SpookyWriter]

And here I thought this was another thread about Spooky.

Bummer, Andre. I hope you're not too far along in the project that your rewrite will have to be uber time consuming.Could have been if I wasn't busy writing and critiquing works. ;)

[SpookyWriter]

I've never had this problem because my work is unique. Yeah right! :roll: Like how many serial killer principles are out there? Huh, I ask you. Or the baby sitter who's an alien in love with the pizza guy. I sad for you to write an original second draft, but look on the bright side. You can always change the sequence or scene to suit your story. Where is it said that everything has been thought, said, or written?

[oswann]

If you have a good idea it's probable five people have the same idea. If you have a great idea the number is probably twenty. Ideas are a dime a dozen and I am wary when someone says they have some totally new idea. Thinking doesn't replace doing. Finish your book.


Os.

[Andre_Laurent]

Darn, I guess I'm not as original as I thought. ^_^; Ah well, I guess its an important thing to come to realize that everything has been done before, one way or another--whats important is making your own way different. Maybe I'll try giving it another shot after all, even though my plot was really very similar in some respects--if I let the characters have free reign maybe they can salvage it for me. It's just extremely disheartening (and intimidating) though to find that your idea has not only been done, but been done by a big name in the field--like JR Ward or Steve Niles. Even if your work is very different, its hard to get people--or editors--to know that at a glance.

Its sorta like how after Harry Potter it'd be pretty hard to write about a wizards school--but when I was a kid, I'd read five or six books about wizarding schools. And all of them were totally different from Harry Potter. So it can be done--its just now, one has to work a bit harder to be different enough to get out from the other persons shadow. maybe the extra work is a good thing though (but a stressful thing nonetheless XD ).

Anyway, I would agree that having a cop character isn't so bad, since they're pretty common. And the trank doesn't sound so bad either simply because its a logical move--its hard to subdue a vampire! ^_^; If the shooter knows the guys' a vampire I'd suggest something like liquid garlic or a vial of holy water, but I'm guessing thats not the case.

I don't know how on earth they'd get hold of tiger (or maybe elephant!) tranks, but I think it'd be highly entertaining to see. :D
I already worked the tiger trank out as I posted. A cocktail of ketamine and valium will drop a tiger. It is obtained from a vet but it can be bought on the streets as vets are sometimes robbed for ketamine (special-k).

The "shooter" character knows he is a vampire and wants info on another vampire (just like in Wards, gggggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr) but I can change that and just make him a mean b*stard (oh yeah, he already is a mean b*stard) who likes to torture things. Cripes, this just gets worse as I go!

And I guess I can change how the cop and vampire run across each other... damn that makes me mad!!!!!

[jpserra]

Darn, I guess I'm not as original as I thought. ^_^; Ah well, I guess its an important thing to come to realize that everything has been done before, ...

This is why writing is so competitive. It's hard to do. It's difficult to be unique and worse, it's nearly impossible to get published.

The separation, the prove up, is when a group of people find your particular voice appealing. That comes after publishing.

JPS

[jpserra]

Sorry about getting off track before. What about PCP? how would it effect a vampire? I mean, we are building a mythos here. Who knows what compounds might sedate a vampire. What if a vampire bit a person who was on PCP, and the druggie turned on the vampire in a sedated state and whooped his butt?

Who says that traditional sedatives, human or other, has to work the same way in a vampire's system. Do they have a system? Do they pump blood? What is the delivery system?

Maybe Bayer Childrens Aspirin kicks thier butts?

JPS

[MattW]

Maybe Bayer Childrens Aspirin kicks thier butts?
And watch out for the Flintstones chewables if you don't want your furniture covered in vampire bits.

[Andre_Laurent]

Sorry about getting off track before. What about PCP? how would it effect a vampire? I mean, we are building a mythos here. Who knows what compounds might sedate a vampire. What if a vampire bit a person who was on PCP, and the druggie turned on the vampire in a sedated state and whooped his butt?

Who says that traditional sedatives, human or other, has to work the same way in a vampire's system. Do they have a system? Do they pump blood? What is the delivery system?

Maybe Bayer Childrens Aspirin kicks thier butts?

JPS
According to what I read last night, Ketamine effects are very close to PCP effects on a user... so I can have some fun with that scene, lol.

I have a scene where the young and dumb vampire dines on a drunk and it sends him off in a drunken stupor, lol. And yeah, I think if he had got jumped he could have had his *** kicked.

[NeuroFizz]

Andre, if you are writing a vampire tale, you can't be too uncomfortable with the idea of walking a worn path. Just use the same strategy for dealing with the similarities between your story and the novel that you use with writing about vampires--just make the story your own.

As for a totally different means of capturing the vampire, try something really contemporary. Have your character load up a woman (or man) with the "date-rape drug" and make the unconscious individual available to the vampire for a little sip. Have the vamp get a little second-hand GHB.

If you inject, do you have to use a silver-needled syringe?

[Andre_Laurent]

As for a totally different means of capturing the vampire, try something really contemporary. Have your character load up a woman (or man) with the "date-rape drug" and make the unconscious individual available to the vampire for a little sip. Have the vamp get a little second-hand GHB.


That's pretty funny. :D

[Shadow_Ferret]

Yeah but if I don't change some of the similar cop/vampire stuff I just know (assuming I actually get it published some day) I'll be accused of "borrowing" from Ward.

Don't worry about the similarities. Think about the differences. I ran into this same problem with my own WIP. I just discovered there is an author named Jim Butcher who has a series out based on a character that is somewhat similar to mine.

His is a wizard, mine is a wizard (although I never use that word, I like sorceror). His lives in the midwest, mine lives in the midwest. His is a PI, mine is merely an on-call occult consultant for the Police Department. After that, there is very little alike between the two except that they are both urban fantasies.

[JimmyB27]

By the time you get to the second or third draft they may have vanished all by themselves.

Concentrate on the parts that are unique to you: your voice, your worldview, your themes.

Listen: I've had one of my novels criticized on the basis that it was "obviously copied" from a novel that I'd never read or even heard of. So what? If nothing else, finishing this book will give you more practice in finishing books, and will get more of the million words out of the way.

My favourite example of this is from Terry Pratchett. He was told that his magical university was obviously a rip off of Hogwarts. He patiently explained that it was unlikely he had copied from a book published some twenty years after his.
To which he got the reply "Ah! So you're saying she copied you then!"

[Andre_Laurent]

Don't worry about the similarities. Think about the differences. I ran into this same problem with my own WIP. I just discovered there is an author named Jim Butcher who has a series out based on a character that is somewhat similar to mine.

His is a wizard, mine is a wizard (although I never use that word, I like sorceror). His lives in the midwest, mine lives in the midwest. His is a PI, mine is merely an on-call occult consultant for the Police Department. After that, there is very little alike between the two except that they are both urban fantasies.
I've changed the things I can. The cop has to stay a cop. I've changed the way the cop and vampire meet a little... more changes than that and I am looking at major rework. Hopefully the differences will pay off.

[J. Weiland]

Couldn't the vampire be knocked out by a good old wooden club? Perhaps the teethy fellow's bloodsugar is low and he is feeling a wee down while stalking the pretty gal, which would allow for the cop to sneak up on him and give him a whack with the aforementioned club.

:D

[Shadow_Ferret]

Couldn't the vampire be knocked out by a good old wooden club? Perhaps the teethy fellow's bloodsugar is low and he is feeling a wee down while stalking the pretty gal, which would allow for the cop to sneak up on him and give him a whack with the aforementioned club.

:D

Oh! Oh! He's suffering from anemia or vampiric diabetes! :)

[Andre_Laurent]

vampiric diabetes! :)

LOL that would be a good way to make a vampire's life... well suck, bah ha ha ha.

[nevada]

Shannon Drake has a series of Vampire novels that involve a cop. JR Ward wasnt the first and she won't be the last. I tried to read the JR Ward, but I couldnt get even halfway through. I'm sure yours will be much better.

Dissect the Ward. You can learn a lot of what not to do. Of course, women are all over the tortured hero but the writing and structure isnt so good.

But like everyone else says, there are no new ideas. There is only new treatment of the idea. Everyone is writing vampire novels right now, even Nora Roberts. There are going to be similarities. Don't worry about it. Write the best book you can.

[Stew21]

I was very excited about a book I had started writing just recently and posted about it here to a few good folks. One of them has a book published and based on my 2 sentence synopses, said, "have you read my book?" I said, "no. why?" He said, "because it sounds like the same thing. It's got the same theme, same basic premise." I felt immediately uneasy, and said as much, and then he said, "a lot of books have that same theme or similar plot points but they are different books, different voices, stories go different directions, your characters have different traits, pasts, characteristics and mannerisms than mine do, etc. Keep writing it. It's your story. I'm not the first to do it. You won't be the last."
I'm fairly certain that most everything has already been done to one degree or another. The way I look at it is I can't stop writing my story everytime I find out someone else wrote one that's similar. It's my story too! My characters are different, plot points are different, dialogue is different, etc.
I can't let similarities prevent me from finishing my story.
Write it. Then re-write it. Let your voice carry it where it needs to be, make it tight and as perfect as you are capable of making it. Everything has "been done" somewhere somehow, so do it again, but your own way. And if nothing else, like Uncle Jim says, "you'll get more of the million words out of the way." :)