MS Word for Novels

[Art]

Whilst writing a novel in Word which is the best line of attack in handling the formatting ie keeping the chapters separate and being able to shift them around freely in MS Word.

Should I use the Outline feature...or is there a website with more precise information.

Art

[scarletpeaches]

Go to insert>break>page and that'll take you to a new page for you to start a new chapter. I'm sorry I can't be more precise but I'm not on my own computer at the moment.

There's definitely a page break function, though. MS Word does everything.

[Jack_Roberts]

Yes! I agree with her. For my MS, I discovered the proper format after I wrote it. Then I went back and changed it. With my current WIP I write it in the proper format already.

Does that help you? Probably not. Just my thoughts.

[RedMolly]

Use the Master Document feature (which, for my money, is far less annoying to work with in OpenOffice Writer, the best open-source software EvAr). You can create links to chapters, rearrange the chapters, do a word count on your whole book, etc.

Master Docs in MS Word (http://addbalance.com/word/masterdocuments.htm)
Master Docs in OpenOffice Writer (http://www.tutorialsforopenoffice.org/tutorial/Create_A_Master_Document.html)

[Julie Worth]

Set up your styles properly, and save it as a template. Use normal for your text, and use heading 1 for chapter headings. You can set it to start a new page. You can also set it to start a third of a page down and to center.

[jpserra]

I have used a number of word processors and software to write with. I began writing on, of course, a typewriter, but the emergence of the computer brought me new options; being able to save and edit.

* The Commodore 64, using PaperClip.
* The IBM PCjr, using MS Write (I still have many of those files around)
* The IBM PC, using Word 2.0. This was where word began to present as a possilble option for heavy detail and novel writing. It did have problems in pagination and handling the formatting of larger documents. I kept Chapter files.

I also used several writing packages, but they were expensive and clumsey to learn. I wanted to write, not learn new software. WordPerfect for Windows was a breath of fresh air, but they have not done as well as Word has.

I use Word for my writing, and use a template of the chapter beginnings to quickly go to work on new chapters. I like the master document feature, but also use the index feature to jump between chapters. I still use a separate index with light description of each chapter to negotiate my editing.

I have a few sites I use in editing, such as www.autocrit.com
I think this is a nice additional component in doing editions.

JPS

[Imelda]

I use Julie's method (only I have more layers of headings :D) and it works great.

[icerose]

Go simple, Ctrl + enter = page break. Then start the chapter a third to half way down the next page, depending on formatting requirements by the publisher you wish to submit to.

[cattywampus]

Another thing: If you write something in Word, and send it to someone who happens to be using WordPerfect or some other program, your formatting may be lost in transit. I applied for a great job, took the test in Word and shot it to them. They wrote back angrily that my formatting was awful and they weren't giving me the job. Turned out they were trying to read it on WordPerfrect. So MS protects their precious product. It took me a long time to get over my distaste for Word. I wish everyone would use WP.

[icerose]

Another thing: If you write something in Word, and send it to someone who happens to be using WordPerfect or some other program, your formatting may be lost in transit. I applied for a great job, took the test in Word and shot it to them. They wrote back angrily that my formatting was awful and they weren't giving me the job. Turned out they were trying to read it on WordPerfrect. So MS protects their precious product. It took me a long time to get over my distaste for Word. I wish everyone would use WP.

Which is exactly why I send everything in either PDF or RTF. Every computer in the world has the capabilities of opening those two files. If they don't have a PDF reader, adobe is a free quick download. Problem solved.

[Julie Worth]

Go simple, Ctrl + enter = page break. Then start the chapter a third to half way down the next page, depending on formatting requirements by the publisher you wish to submit to.

This is where "going simple" can create work. If you let Word work for you by using a heading style for chapter headings, then you can tailor your MS for specific recipients by changing the heading style alone, and each instance of it changes automatically. If you don't do this, if you insert breaks manually and somebody doesn't like the way you've set up your chapters, then you'll have to change each chapter heading individually, and that's a lot of work if you have 50 chapters.

[Art]

Still waiting for the definitive anwswer otherwise this witblits is going to kill me...this work has to be properly formatted by tomorrow...so you see I am in quite a quandary.

Art

[icerose]

This is where "going simple" can create work. If you let Word work for you by using a heading style for chapter headings, then you can tailor your MS for specific recipients by changing the heading style alone, and each instance of it changes automatically. If you don't do this, if you insert breaks manually and somebody doesn't like the way you've set up your chapters, then you'll have to change each chapter heading individually, and that's a lot of work if you have 50 chapters.

I don't use chapter headings and I don't use Word so I don't have either of those problems.

Art:

What part of formatting don't you understand? Be specific and you'll get a specific answer.

12 point courier 1 inch margins all around, double spaced, 25 lines per page, chapter beings half way down on a new page, headers have your name, name of book, and page number.

Lastname/bookname >left align< >right align< Page #

That's basic formatting.

And what are witblits???

Also on the larger question. I keep my entire book in one piece, chapters fall right after each other, if I need to find something, I do the find function, if I need to rearrange something I do copy and paste. If you are submitting it they will want it in one file rather than broken up into several files. If you are printing it out then it doesn't really matter other than it will screw up your page numbering of course.

Title page - Title half way down, double return, by double return, your name.

Contact information on the lower left.

[aghast]

book marks - you can easily jump around and they move with the text too

[aghast]

Use the Master Document feature (which, for my money, is far less annoying to work with in OpenOffice Writer, the best open-source software EvAr). You can create links to chapters, rearrange the chapters, do a word count on your whole book, etc.

Master Docs in MS Word (http://addbalance.com/word/masterdocuments.htm)
Master Docs in OpenOffice Writer (http://www.tutorialsforopenoffice.org/tutorial/Create_A_Master_Document.html)


funny you should suggest those links because they say 'dont use master docs' since it will corrupt your documents

[HConn]

The easiest way to deal with it is to create two new styles: "Fiction" and "Chapter Headings"

When you create the latter, you should be able to put a check mark into "page break before" which will always start a Chapter Heading on a new page.

Once you click around and explore styles a little bit, it's pretty easy.

Good luck.

[Rabe]

Yes! I agree with her. For my MS, I discovered the proper format after I wrote it. Then I went back and changed it. With my current WIP I write it in the proper format already.

Does that help you? Probably not. Just my thoughts.

Years ago I found and downloaded a book template that automatically formats for chapters, puts everything in Courier 12pt font and even has fields for automatic word count and the like. It's formatted for MS Word and after it's placed in the proper folder, you can pull it up under the 'templates' function of MS Word.

I find it very invaluable but forget who it is that coded the macros that makes it possible. It even puts in automatic bookmarks from where you left off so that as you open the file it puts you back where you were at. So when editing you don't have to to try to remember page numbers or anything...you're already there.

I normally write my novels in my own format and then copy and paste over to the book template. Mainly because I like writing with a solid black background and 25% gray stylized font.

If anyone wants a copy of the template, PM me and I'll send it. Like I said, I don't have the original creator's information but am not presenting this as my work.

Rabe...

[Del]

* The Commodore 64, using PaperClip.



I loved my C=64. I used The Write Stuff when I graduated to the C=128

It is nice to see I'm not the only antique computer user here.

I almost bought a VIC20 - when it was NEW!

[Youthful voices echoing from the corners; A Vic what?]

[san_remo_ave]

Here's another option for keeping track of chapters

http://perso.orange.fr/sebastien.berthet/cbc/

It's a little freeware program called Chapter by Chapter and was written because the Master Document feature in MSW is so buggy. Basically the premise is you create each chapter as separate .docs and you can keep track and rearrange thru this little freeware program. When you're done it will compile and dump all of the individual files into a single big one.

Might be worth a looksie to see if it meets your needs.

[Linda Adams]

Use the Master Document feature (which, for my money, is far less annoying to work with in OpenOffice Writer, the best open-source software EvAr). You can create links to chapters, rearrange the chapters, do a word count on your whole book, etc.

Master Docs in MS Word (http://addbalance.com/word/masterdocuments.htm)
Master Docs in OpenOffice Writer (http://www.tutorialsforopenoffice.org/tutorial/Create_A_Master_Document.html)

Do not use the master document feature in Word. It's extremely buggy, and worse still, very, very likely to corrupt. This is a link from one of the MVPs describing this: http://word.mvps.org/FAQS/General/WhyMasterDocsCorrupt.htm

[RedMolly]

I've been using master docs in OpenOffice to write multi-chapter nonfiction since 2002 (5 special issues of the same magazine) and fiction since 2003 (2 novels in progress) and never had a problem with corruption. Maybe I'm just not doing anything particularly weird or screwy.

[badducky]

I've had problems jumping from one year to the next. I wouldn't recommend mixing your versions of Word. '97 and '02 don't get along.

Siblings never do.

[Amiton]

I've been using master docs in OpenOffice to write multi-chapter nonfiction since 2002 (5 special issues of the same magazine) and fiction since 2003 (2 novels in progress) and never had a problem with corruption. Maybe I'm just not doing anything particularly weird or screwy.

I think the discrepancy is coming from two different angles. If I'm reading correctly, all of the arguments against Master Docs are from the MS Word side of the house. You're citing OpenOffice, RedMolly. Perhaps it's another matter of Microsoft not properly adopting a standard?

Amiton.

[zornhau]

Whilst writing a novel in Word which is the best line of attack in handling the formatting ie keeping the chapters separate and being able to shift them around freely in MS Word.

Should I use the Outline feature...or is there a website with more precise information.

Art

It depends how you write.

I'm hooked on Outline View... http://zornhau.livejournal.com/72037.html

Don't use Ctrl+Return to insert page breaks. Instead define your Chapter style (perhaps Heading 1) with Page Break Before.

[PeeDee]

Still waiting for the definitive anwswer otherwise this witblits is going to kill me...this work has to be properly formatted by tomorrow...so you see I am in quite a quandary.

Art

You're going to be waiting 'till the stars go cold. The closest you're going to get to a definitive answer is to go to the publisher you want to send to, format like they tell you to. Even that's not definitive, because the next publisher in line will possibly have a different set of instructions.

[DeeJay]

[quote=Rabe;890790]Years ago I found and downloaded a book template that automatically formats for chapters, puts everything in Courier 12pt font and even has fields for automatic word count and the like. It's formatted for MS Word and after it's placed in the proper folder, you can pull it up under the 'templates' function of MS Word.

I find it very invaluable but forget who it is that coded the macros that makes it possible. It even puts in automatic bookmarks from where you left off so that as you open the file it puts you back where you were at. So when editing you don't have to to try to remember page numbers or anything...you're already there.

I normally write my novels in my own format and then copy and paste over to the book template. Mainly because I like writing with a solid black background and 25% gray stylized font.

If anyone wants a copy of the template, PM me and I'll send it. Like I said, I don't have the original creator's information but am not presenting this as my work.

Rabe...[Please forward me the template: dirk@capecommercial.co.za

[blacbird]

Still waiting for the definitive anwswer otherwise this witblits is going to kill me...this work has to be properly formatted by tomorrow...so you see I am in quite a quandary.

Art

Art, you haven't explained your problem very exactly. Are you writing the novel, or formatting the manuscript for submission? Or, formatting for publication (if so, you probably need to get the thing into a publication layout program such as MS-Publisher).

Submission formatting, at least for what is expected in the U.S., is really pretty simple. As Scarletpeaches and Icerose have suggested, just insert manual page breaks after every chapter break, and start the next chapter about 1/3 of the way down the page (seven lines down works for me). Double-space the manuscript throughout, and leave it aligned to the left (do not right-justify). Use a standard font, either Courier 12 pt. or Times New Roman 12 pt. And set margins to a minimum of 1" all around. I paginate using a header, my name on the left, name of work + page number on the right).

All of this takes me about five minutes to accomplish after I've finished the manuscript. I don't do it in advance, because for my eyes, I don't like the screen-readability. I have poor eyesight, and prefer to work in Garamond font, 14-pt., and single-spaced, when actually writing.

I find all the whizbang templates and styles, etc., a pain in the butt, mainly, at least for working on a fiction manuscript.

caw

[Bufty]

Control + Enter when I wish to start a new chapter serves me fine. Also means if I'm subsequently adding or deleting stuff in any one chapter it doesn't affect the formatting in later chapters.

[wyntermoon]

DeeJay, you may want to erase your email address from your post so as not to tempt the mighty spambots. I'd suggest PMing Rabe directly.

[Matera the Mad]

Bear in mind that more than half of the people likely to try to answer a question about Word as they understand it have no idea that there is such a thing as Outline View or don't know what it is for.

I don't write in Word (I consider it an abomination for that) but when I am beta-reading someone else's doc I like to go through it and establish an outline so I can find my way around. (That's how I know...)

[J C Coy]

Go simple, Ctrl + enter = page break. Then start the chapter a third to half way down the next page, depending on formatting requirements by the publisher you wish to submit to.
Yeah, what Icerose said.

[zornhau]

Whilst writing a novel in Word which is the best line of attack in handling the formatting ie keeping the chapters separate and being able to shift them around freely in MS Word.

Should I use the Outline feature...or is there a website with more precise information.

Art

It depends on how you write.

I'm a technical author by trade, so have a professional knowledge of MS Word having used it as my workhorse for about a decade. I've also used MS Word to write a 100K novel. So what follows is a personal view, but an informed one.

If you have MS Word, use it. The Outline View feature is fantastic and much better than on Open Office. Overall, despite the bloat, Word is a reliable professional tool. (Do not, however, use Master Documents since this means having lots of separate files, with the potential to get into a guddle. A modern PC can easily handle a full sized novel as a single file).

I composed mainly in Outline View using the built in heading levels. (Heading 1... Heading n) to create and maintain my outline, and Normal for the actual text. However, if you are not writing from outline, then you might as well set up Heading 1 to show chapter numbers and Heading 2 to show scene breaks only ("# # #'"). This will let you shift them around.

If you are writing from outline, you'll eventually need to strip out the sub headings. I have macros to do this, which I don't mind sharing.

Other useful features are: footnotes, which are great for world building on the fly - put thoughts in the footnotes as you write, then collate them later; and comments. (Do not, however, write a novel with Track Changes switched on.)

As I said, it depends on how you write. Hope this helps. Really it's very straightforward, but if you get stuck PM me and I'll write a blog post in response.

[Birol]

Um... Guys... Feel free to keep commenting. The information you're giving is quite useful to many... I hesitate to point this out... but you realize Art originally posted in 2006?

Deejay's bumped the thread up in order to ask Rabe to forward a template.

Just sayin'. Carry on.

[RJK]

Good point Birol, but some good points were brought up, especially by Zornhau.

If I can add my $.02, in addition to using a heading level (I use level 3) for scenes, while I'm working on the document, I include a description of the scene in the heading. i.e. # INT. Assessor’s Office City Hall Tue 6/24 1540. The description helps me keep track of the day, date, time and location of each scene. I delete all but the '#' when I'm ready to print.

[ricgalbraith]

loads of great tips and tricks in here, as someone who's wondered whether or not word is the best app for the job it's answered a few questions, thanks guys

[Roger J Carlson]

There are quite a lot of tips and trick for MS Word in the Tech Help Forum. There's an Index to them called, oddly enough, Index of Tips and Tricks (http://absolutewrite.com/forums/showthread.php?p=428519#post428519).

[James81]

Just use a hard return (Cntrl+Enter).

[James81]

Or maybe it's Shift + Enter. Can't remember at the moment.