PAMB and its quotes

NancyMehl · Sep 12, 2006

Having worked with an editor at a large newspaper for over three years, AND having worked with editors associated with various book publishers, I can say without a doubt that "those two dogs run different."

They are absolutely NOT the same thing.

Whoever said that has no idea what they're talking about.

Nancy

James D. Macdonald · Sep 12, 2006

However, resisting getting edited by PA's t/r/a/i/n/e/d/ m/o/n/k/e/y/s/ editors is a good idea.

Arkie · Sep 12, 2006

James D. Macdonald said:
However, resisting getting edited by PA's t/r/a/i/n/e/d/ m/o/n/k/e/y/s/ editors is a good idea.

I agree. In my case, I edited my ms 13 times, forward, backward and sideways. I looked at that manuscript everyway possible, and the same thing with the proofs; however, when I received my two copies and opened the book, the first thing I found was an error.

I don't know who they hire to pose as editors, but I doubt, other than completing the required college English courses (if that), those personnel have no editing qualifications in the strict sense of the word, and I can state unequivically mine did not know the difference in two, too and to.

In the process of putting books together and getting them printer ready, through computer glitches or whatever, errors are often inserted and sometimes in strange places. I had the word "whom" inserted in an indention. The word had absolutely nothing to do with the sentence preceding or following, and it was not in the final proofs I submitted.

I think my greatest disappointment with the company was the lack of editing expertise, and moreso, the lack of pride demonstrated by their willingness to print a substandard book, and unwillingness to make changes, when brought to their attention.

Saundra Julian · Sep 14, 2006

Another pearl of wisdom from the PAMB...

Some doubt the statement I'm fixing to make, usually it's those who are published with bigger publishing houses. There is a conspiracy to keep down up and coming authors. Let's just face the facts. Unless you are proven to be a big seller for a large house and promote an agenda, they won't even look at your stuff. I get tired of the propoganda put out by certain sites that you only need to write a good book. That's bogus. The people who make the decisions stay around for decades and they don't want change. If they wanted change, they would invest in new ideas and the such.

How many fake legal cases can the market stand? How many overly used adjective makers will the big houses publish? The stuff that floods the market is all the same. If you've read one Templar book, you've read them all. If you read one Sci-Fi story, you already know the basis of all others. In Sci-Fi, there are usually bounty hunters, a galactic federation, a war of some kind, and it's the same old stuff. I thought part of being an author was having creativity. Star Wars has come and gone. Do a service to your readers, do something new.

Guess someone needs to tell the Sci-Fi authors they are wasting their time writing a new book as "they're all the same old stuff!"

Guess the rest of us might as well give up too!

spike · Sep 14, 2006

Saundra Julian said:
Another pearl of wisdom from the PAMB...

Some doubt the statement I'm fixing to make, usually it's those who are published with bigger publishing houses. There is a conspiracy to keep down up and coming authors. Let's just face the facts. Unless you are proven to be a big seller for a large house and promote an agenda, they won't even look at your stuff. I get tired of the propoganda put out by certain sites that you only need to write a good book. That's bogus. The people who make the decisions stay around for decades and they don't want change. If they wanted change, they would invest in new ideas and the such.

How many fake legal cases can the market stand? How many overly used adjective makers will the big houses publish? The stuff that floods the market is all the same. If you've read one Templar book, you've read them all. If you read one Sci-Fi story, you already know the basis of all others. In Sci-Fi, there are usually bounty hunters, a galactic federation, a war of some kind, and it's the same old stuff. I thought part of being an author was having creativity. Star Wars has come and gone. Do a service to your readers, do something new.

Guess someone needs to tell the Sci-Fi authors they are wasting their time writing a new book as "they're all the same old stuff!"

Guess the rest of us might as well give up too!

He is right about one thing. Publishers don't want change. They want to keep publishing books that will sell.

Bubastes · Sep 14, 2006

spike said:
He is right about one thing. Publishers don't want change. They want to keep publishing books that will sell.

Oh gee, what a coincidence. So do writers!

James D. Macdonald · Sep 14, 2006

Some doubt the statement I'm fixing to make....

Doubt it? I'm going to call bullsh!t on it.

About 20% of the novels in bookstores this year were first novels.

(Oh, and Jeffery? How many copies of your own book did you buy? I know you didn't have to, but how many did you? And how many have sold? Any to someone you didn't know by name?)

Eric Summers · Sep 14, 2006

Saundra Julian said:
Another pearl of wisdom from the PAMB...

If you read one Sci-Fi story, you already know the basis of all others. In Sci-Fi, there are usually bounty hunters, a galactic federation, a war of some kind, and it's the same old stuff. I thought part of being an author was having creativity. Star Wars has come and gone. Do a service to your readers, do something new.

Guess someone needs to tell the Sci-Fi authors they are wasting their time writing a new book as "they're all the same old stuff!"

That made me laugh. Sci-Fi has taken such a huge turn from the old space opera formulas that the books of today would not even be classified as Sci-Fi 20 years ago I bet.

One only has to look at the bestseller "House of Leaves" (the author's debut novel) to see that the myth of "the publishers don't want to take any chances on new authors" is total crap. Here is a book by a NEW writer that featured (among other things) 3 seperate storylines told at once, pages with as few as ONE single word on them, pages where the type was laid out in steps, pyramids, or other shapes, footnotes that ran of for dozens of pages BACKWARDS through the book, etc, etc. You don't even have to READ House of Leaves, just 1 minute flipping through it at your bookstore will show you that it is beyond a doubt not just "the same old thing".

James D. Macdonald · Sep 14, 2006

Nah, Eric. Jeffery isn't talking about (and doesn't know anything about) SF (or "Sci-Fi" as he's pleased to call it). Those are all personal attacks against me. He's still pouting after I kicked his rump in that radio debate.

Bubastes · Sep 14, 2006

James D. Macdonald said:
Nah, Eric. Jeffery isn't talking about (and doesn't know anything about) SF (or "Sci-Fi" as he's pleased to call it). Those are all personal attacks against me. He's still pouting after I kicked his rump in that radio debate.

Oh, do tell! I haven't heard about this one.

SeanDSchaffer · Sep 14, 2006

James D. Macdonald said:
Nah, Eric. Jeffery isn't talking about (and doesn't know anything about) SF (or "Sci-Fi" as he's pleased to call it). Those are all personal attacks against me. He's still pouting after I kicked his rump in that radio debate.

My guess is that he is also getting this information from PA itself. Probably from the same tired old line that produced the classic worst-book-scenario, Atlanta Nights.

triceretops · Sep 15, 2006

I was daydreaming today wandering how to make PA wealthy when suddenly a wacky idea came to mind. After careful research I figured out that PA makes money off of the books they sale, then why not try to sell as many books as possible. PA has a treasure trove of books and authors. Why not bulk mail their titles to residents across the United States for purchase, much like double day book club. Invest a little reap a lot. Like I said, just daydreaming.

PA is already wealthy...off you. It does not take CAREFUL research to know that a publisher has to sell books to stay afloat. They are not going to spend the money on bulk mail to send out titles (books?) or media kits to outlets, with the hope of selling them. They know the odds against this--the percentages don't pay off.

Tri

PVish · Sep 15, 2006

From http://bb.publishamerica.com/viewtopic.php?t=16612:

Why not bulk mail their titles to residents across the United States for purchase, much like double day book club.

Yeah, like we need more junk mail. Today I threw two "book club" offers into the trash.

If PA put all its 20,000 titles (including the ones they released) into a catalogue, can you imagine the weight of that sucker?

If PA really wanted to sell books to other than its authors, it might make the PA bookstore a bit easier to use or at least have a toll-free number for buyers to use when they order. But that would require effort--and money to pay someone to answer the phone, etc.

SeanDSchaffer · Sep 15, 2006

PVish said:
If PA really wanted to sell books to other than its authors, it might make the PA bookstore a bit easier to use or at least have a toll-free number for buyers to use when they order. But that would require effort--and money to pay someone to answer the phone, etc.

My Emphasis.

I think they used to have a toll-free number for ordering....for the authors to use. I don't think that the average person could order using that number, though.

astonwest · Sep 16, 2006

PVish said:
...or at least have a toll-free number for buyers to use when they order.

They used to have a toll-free number.
I believe they got rid of it because all of their authors were calling all the time to complain...not sure how costs are calculated for a toll-free number, but my guess is that it's based on how many calls you field.

astonwest · Sep 16, 2006

SeanDSchaffer said:
I don't think that the average person could order using that number, though.

I think anyone who knew that the number existed could order with that number. Unfortunately, the only people who knew about it were authors and anyone the authors told.

Tsu Dho Nimh · Sep 17, 2006

Mass-marketing by authors?

Folks: here's why PA is doing such a disservice to its authors. Real publishers, even small presses, can get your books into the distribution channels where the titles will be put in front of buyers from libraries and bookstores.

PA leaves its authors slogging through the swamps, chained to a onesy-twosy publishing method that guarantees they can't get into the channel and onto the same boat as the authors who have real publishers. They are trying to create an alternate marketing channel, for an overpriced product of variable quality.

Fri Sep 15, 2006 4:41 pm
Post subject: PA MARKETING IDEA?

"I was daydreaming today wandering how to make PA wealthy when suddenly a wacky idea came to mind. After careful research I figured out that PA makes money off of the books they sale, then why not try to sell as many books as possible. PA has a treasure trove of books and authors. Why not bulk mail their titles to residents across the United States for purchase, much like double day book club."
***********
[brief explanation of problems with bulk mail]"Nevertheless, I think your idea could work, if PA, or a large group of PA authors who wanted to pool their resources, could get their hands on lists of people who have demonstrated a favorable pattern of behavour by ordered a certain amount of books online during the past year.

In fact, with the way PA has been slighted on the promotional end of the industry, I'm suprised they haven't tried this themselves. Cut out all those middlemen who pay them little respect and go directly to the paying customer. They certainly have enough titles with a wide enough range of interests.

They already have changed the way the publishing industry does business with authors, now it is time for them to change the way the promotional end of the business is conducted, for their benefit and the benefit of the thousands of authors they have published."

Christine N. · Sep 17, 2006

Yeah, "PA has been slighted on the promotional end of the industry."

Like they try. Sigh.

NancyMehl · Sep 19, 2006

PAMB

Here's another interesting discussion:

http://bb.publishamerica.com/viewtopic.php?t=16677

Nancy

James D. Macdonald · Sep 19, 2006

Ah, I see it's time for the Let's Do a Catalog! and the Let's Do a Bookclub! ideas to float up on the PAMB. Happens every year or so, whenever the old crop of authors that tried and failed vanishes and a brand new crop all starry-eyed arrives.

Christine N. · Sep 19, 2006

yeah, and whatever happened to the 200 Authors book? Haven't heard from the guy who came up with that one in a while. What was his name? The theory of everything guy, right?

The ideas come and go, and I'll bet PA made a pretty penny off of that venture, you know at least some of the authors bought it.

rekirts · Sep 19, 2006

From the PAMB re: the 'experiment' of making the books returnable:

I will give it a try. I think this experiment has been very success because if it wasn’t I believe it would have been cancelled by now.

A success for PA, yes, because bookstore still won't put PA books on their shelves and the authors still can't sell books without buying thier own. A success for the authors? Not on your life.

Eric Summers · Sep 19, 2006

Christine N. said:
yeah, and whatever happened to the 200 Authors book? Haven't heard from the guy who came up with that one in a while. What was his name? The theory of everything guy, right?

The ideas come and go, and I'll bet PA made a pretty penny off of that venture, you know at least some of the authors bought it.

JC Keohane was his name, he compiled the "200 Authors and How They Were Published" book. Like all 456 page softcover books, this one is "competitively priced" at a mere $29.95*

*Note I am not knocking John for the price, we all know who is responsible for that!

TwentyFour · Sep 19, 2006

I'm sure that was a big seller! A two hundred author catalog of unknowns and the author sports it from one store to another to show they really have been published. The guy at the counter looks at it, smiles...and says:

...no thanks buddy...

then the author goes off on the guy. Buy my book! Stock my book! I'm a real author with the best publishing house in the good ole U..S..of A! I'll be back everyday with my homemade bookmarks, tablecloth, and cookies for a signing party...

The store owners love these guys!

To be honest, we have only had one PA book publisher to set up a signing in our town. The stores that let her in: the two she worked for and neither were book stores. One a grocery store, the other was a clothing store...it would appear that PA isn't a hit in my town!

Christine N. · Sep 19, 2006

Eric Summers said:
JC Keohane was his name, he compiled the "200 Authors and How They Were Published" book. Like all 456 page softcover books, this one is "competitively priced" at a mere $29.95*

*Note I am not knocking John for the price, we all know who is responsible for that!

Oi, the four stellar reviews of this silly thing make my head hurt. Who ever heard of reviewing a catalog?

PAMB and its quotes

She Who Resonates...

Your Genial Uncle

a reader's ear and a writer's heart

A work in progress

Mostly Ignored

bananaed

Your Genial Uncle

Apply Directly to Forehead

Your Genial Uncle

bananaed

SeanDSchaffer

Cat hair collector

SeanDSchaffer

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment

2 WIP? A glutton for punishment

haz a shiny new book cover

She Who Resonates...

Your Genial Uncle

haz a shiny new book cover

NOooooo!!!

Apply Directly to Forehead

practical experience, FTW

haz a shiny new book cover