Do you use a 'pen name'?

[Horizon_eyes]

Hi everyone.

I wanted to ask about the issue of pen names. Is using a pen name the norm, or do you feel that using your real name is the right way to go.

I do have a pen name in mind. But perhaps there are other things to consider, such as, whether it's necessary to trademark a pen name or not. That's just one example.

Another question would be, if I'm sending a query letter to an agent as a new author, should I mention that the book was written using a pen name (such as on the title sheet), or just start to conduct communication using that pen name, etc.

In that case, what if the agent likes the book but not the pen name?

I know, lot's of questions. :)

[fanatic]

The only reasons I could see for using a pen name are:

a. you're on the run from the mob
b. your parents named you Candy Cane, and you write crime dramas
c. if you authored a book titled "Man-Monkey Love"--while working as a monkey handler in a zoo
d. you are a successful porn star trying to break into the children's market

Sorry, I'm a dumb*ss with no usable knowledge. ;) Hope you get some real answers.

[Horizon_eyes]

You must be psychic as all the above applies to me.

- Candy

(just kidding)

[Ghost RYter]

I use a pen name for many reasons (only partly mob related....)
I have a long , crazy Italian last name which is does not slide off the tounge "properly" and that most cannot pronounce..... ALSO , Its nice to be anonymous for lots of reasons , I prefer it that way , but most do not .
As far as copywriting a pen name , I dont belive it to be nessasary , nor really matter (possibly if you are a #1 best seller or something)
DEFINTLY let your agent , editor , publisher know that you are using a pen name or the checks might be hard to cash lol (actually direct deposit is now the norm so you never know)

[stormie]

Fanatic's list is good. :) If you do decide to use a pen name (I don't, even though I write in almost every genre), your real name will go on the top left corner of the first page (with address, etc) then just under the title of the work, your byline would be your pen name, not your real name.

[Horizon_eyes]

Very good information!

I am leaning towards a pen name, with hesitation. My real name has, well, sentimental value. After all, it's me. And my first name is somewhat unique -- at least a common name that is spelled differently, and hard to forget.

And it's not that I don't think my own name wouldn't work, either.

Anonymity does have it's appeal, especially if my work takes off (which I will be working very hard towards that goal). In other words, I'm not looking for mainly hometown notoriety.

I'm sort of interested in talking about my pen name ideas with someone without mentioning them publicly though. Eventually I'd like to get honest feedback from a number of people, mainly writers. I think probably very few non-writers would truly appreciate the value of a pen-name, nor would be qualified to give feedback of a pen-name for its appropriateness to a specific genre.

I admit though, I'm torn on the issue. I like my own name and think it would work. Googling me though currently tells of former positions I've had and previous occupations / community involvements. Nothing bad, it's just that when I'm ready to start promoting, I want to be seen as 'author', and not 'former manager of xyz company'. It would be like googling John Grisham if there were residual web pages that haven't been maintained in years, appearing in the search results, that still list him as "ABC Dealership's top car salesman" (a hypothetical example)

That's why something as simple as using a pen name is something of a conundrum to me. Sentiment vs. Anonimity, and both seem marketable -- at least from my perspective.

[DeborahM]

Lots of writers use pen names. Stephen King was Richard Bach and Dean Koontz is on his 10th pen name I hear.

One main reason is: If you are contracted under a house under your name and the sales are not as high as they had hoped, your next book to be published will equal to the amount of sales you had on your first book. Therefore, your advance will also reflect this. If sales are still down, your in trouble.

Now, if you write another book under a pen name, you are not under contract with that house and can go to another house and start with a clean slate. It's been done many, many times.

[alanna]

::shrug:: as of now, I like the thrill of seeing my name in print. :)

[Horizon_eyes]

Actually, from what I understand there is another author named Richard Bach, different from Steven King, whose pseudonymn is Richard Bachman
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Bachman , but I understand the point made which is very valuable. I guess that drives home to me what I need to do. I suppose it's good to think ahead before jumping in.


::shrug:: as of now, I like the thrill of seeing my name in print. :)


I bet that is exciting! I wish you all the best.

We all have different circumstances. Perhaps I'm too analytical about the situation. I just want to make sure I'm taking the right steps, in new territory. When this book is finished, it will be my first literary submission.

[Bamponang]

A writer may also choose to use a pen name if he/she writes in different genres. I use a pen name for that reason.

I write tech business articles under my own name. If you googled that name, you'd also see past positions and articles that are completely unrelated to what i'm about right now. That bothers me a bit, because I would like some consistency ( in subject matter)to be associated with my name.

That is why I now publish all non-fiction that is not related to the tech business stuff under a pen name.

I also write children's fiction using my real name, and it does not interfere in any way in my tech business writing. For the most part, those readers see the fiction writing as an indication that I'm a balanced individual. And they may have kids....

[Soccer Mom]

I write under a pen name in order to keep my day job seperate from my fiction writing. It isn't unusual at all. Just query under your regular name and don't worry about it. When you get a request for a partial or a full, on your cover page simply drop down under your name and put "writing as XXX YYY". Don't worry about copyright for the name or anything else at this point.

[ChunkyC]

Hi kids. I moved this thread as it's really not about 'goals and accomplishments.'

[Silver King]

I have to admit I like your confidence, Horizon. It doesn't seem misplaced and has a texture I can almost feel on my skin.

I wonder if anyone ever started out with a pen name and then regretted it later; or started out with their real name and wished they hadn't.

If I were to use a pen name, it would have to be Montblanc.

[Jamesaritchie]

I use several pseudonyms on a regular basis, both for privacy, and because I write in several genres.

There's no need to trademark a pen name, and it wouldn't do you any good, anyway.

[stormie]

I use several pseudonyms on a regular basis.

Thought so. :D

[Southern_girl29]

I don't have any answers for you, but I wanted to say that I have thought about it, too. My last name is kind of hard to say. No one ever gets it right. I want to keep my first name though. I thought about writing under my maiden name. I haven't made a decision yet.

[Horizon_eyes]

Another issue I've thought of is family -- not that it would be a factor for one's decision to use a pen name. But still I wonder if anyone ever had friction from family who wonder, "what's wrong with the name we gave you when you were born?", etc.

I think mine would understand though, coming from a family history in the arts. I've often wondered if that's ever been an issue though. I'm thinking parents or siblings, along those lines.

Spouses and children would probably understand, especially for the anonymity factor. Any author I'm sure has their share of 'fans'. I wouldn't be too thrilled about having my family or myself getting unwanted contacts or 'personal visits', etc. It can be a crazy world.

[veinglory]

I would suggest using a pen name if you have a reason to--but a real name otherwise as it will help with promoting etc.

[Jamesaritchie]

I would suggest using a pen name if you have a reason to--but a real name otherwise as it will help with promoting etc.

You promote a pen name the same way you promote a real name. They aren't any more difficult at all to promote.

[veinglory]

I was going on one publisher saying the prefered writers who were out in the open--but now that I think about it that is different from using a pseud. Although using a pseud and appearing in person would mean people would inevitably know who I was I still wouldn't need to use my real name....

[Horizon_eyes]

The only way I can imagine a pen name being hard to promote is if it's unmarketable. What Fanatic said earlier actually raises a good point. One would assume that someone who's a writer could come up with a good pen name, but I think it's possible that the chosen pen name may not work for the genre, or may sound too silly, uncatchy, etc.

Makes me wonder if works would ever be turned down because the publisher just couldn't get past the pen name.

I've also seen some real names in which I thought might have the same effect.

[Ghost RYter]

Often a pen name is more easily promoted than ones real name ..... The sad truth is that etnicity is a real factor in why people often decide upon a book .... 2 of the same books with the same title in 2 seperate stores may do very diffrently in sales if one was authored by "JACK STEEL" and one listed under tyhe name "osama muhhamed"
I know thats extreme , but true .

[R_Filyaw]

Ethnicity aside, some people simply have embarassing names. Mine can be difficult to pronounce (I don't know why. It's two syllables that are said they way they're read). It's also embarassing to say at times, especially if you have a southern accent like mine.
If you haven't noticed, my last name is Filyaw.
So yeah, as much as I like the name, I pen.

[Horizon_eyes]

My last name is one that can be easily poked fun of as well. It's not really embarrasing, and still I like it -- it actually is a good name I think for a writer. Some famous actors have my last name.

I still think I'm leaning towards a pen name when I finish my book though. If it bombs, I can always start over with a clean slate, and a new name.

Or, perhaps i should even write with my real name, and pen on future books until I find one that works.

I have a feeling when the time comes I'm just going to have to flip a coin.

[beezle]

My name is all I really have. It may not be worth anything, but hey, it's mine.

[Scrawler]

I've use a modified version of my name for non-fiction/freelance, but for my novel, I'll have to come up with something different. There's already an author with MY name who wrote a book on a topic I would never write about. I'd hate for people to confuse us.

[Horizon_eyes]

There's already an author with MY name who wrote a book on a topic I would never write about. I'd hate for people to confuse us.

lol!


My name is all I really have. It may not be worth anything, but hey, it's mine.

A real name is always valuable, imo. Not that they always work better than pen names in every case, but there's just something to be said when the public sees the real McCoy.

Even if your name were, well, McCoy.

[Jamesaritchie]

Makes me wonder if works would ever be turned down because the publisher just couldn't get past the pen name.

I've also seen some real names in which I thought might have the same effect.

If the publisher really hates the pseudonym, they just ask you to choose another, and may even come up with one for you.

[Lolly]

Spouses and children would probably understand, especially for the anonymity factor. Any author I'm sure has their share of 'fans'. I wouldn't be too thrilled about having my family or myself getting unwanted contacts or 'personal visits', etc. It can be a crazy world.

On the off chance that I might become the next Dan Brown or John Grisham (hey, we can all dream :D ), I wouldn't want some nut or even just die-hard fan tracking me down and harassing me. That, and I think it might get to me after a while if people kept saying, "XY? Aren't you the woman who wrote...?"

[Sidmyster]

im not 'up' with the publishing scene but i would never use a pen name.

[R_Filyaw]

If you're not 'up' with the publishing scene, then it wouldn't matter if you had a pen name, would it?

[Silver King]

Aw, come on now, R. Did you really have to say that?

[Sidmyster]

true

but i can still give my opinion....and that is if i do ever publidh my work i wouldnt use a pen name

[Silver King]

Did you see what happened, Sid? We posted at exactly the same time, or almost. I beat you by three seconds. Does that mean I win?

You just keep right on expressing your opinions. I'd love to hear them. And if anyone else tries to give you a hard time, I'll yank on their dangling participle so hard, they'll turn inside out.

[R_Filyaw]

I was asking a legitimate question. If you have a problem with it, tell it to notepad.

[Silver King]

There's a difference between legitimacy and asinine. Yours bordered on the latter.

[Horizon_eyes]

If I may intervene... (and if I may not, I'm going to anyway! ...just kidding)

I think Sidmyster was just stating a personal preference.... not really saying 'no one should use pen names'...?

Anyway, I'm thankful for any input -- but also curious as to know why or why not. I'm still sitting on the fence on this one, leaning from one side to the other.

The way I see it, pen names have their place, but it all depends on each circumstance.

[SeanDSchaffer]

I'm thinking about using a pen name for my first work, if only because I sometimes think the name Sean D. Schaffer is a boring name. I have a friend who used a variation of his own name as a pen name. I might do that; I don't know just yet, though.

[MMWyrm]

I plan to use a pen name with anything I happen to get published because I refuse to attach my married name (which I stupidly kept after my divorce) to anything that pours out of my soul.

[Sidmyster]

If I may intervene... (and if I may not, I'm going to anyway! ...just kidding)

I think Sidmyster was just stating a personal preference.... not really saying 'no one should use pen names'...?

Anyway, I'm thankful for any input -- but also curious as to know why or why not. I'm still sitting on the fence on this one, leaning from one side to the other.

The way I see it, pen names have their place, but it all depends on each circumstance.
Yup was just saying that i wouldnt use one

I wouldnt use one as i dont see myself as the sort of person who would want to publish under a different name

Although i wouldnt do it i can understand why some authors choose to do so.


And cheers for the support silver :)

[scribbler1382]

FYI, James Rollins, the Thriller writer, writes Fantasy novels under the name James Clemens.

His real name is Dr. James Czajkowski (Vet).

Just a datapoint.

[Horizon_eyes]

I'm thinking about using a pen name for my first work, if only because I sometimes think the name Sean D. Schaffer is a boring name. I have a friend who used a variation of his own name as a pen name. I might do that; I don't know just yet, though.

Sean D Schaffer actually seems catchy to me. But I don't want to persuade you either way, do what you think works for you and your writing.

[beezle]

Come to think of it, my two middle names make a reasonable full name by themselves. So I suppose I have this covered if it comes to that.

[Alan Yee]

I would prefer to always use my real name on my published fiction, if at all possible. My name is short, only 7 letters, it's not extremely common, and (as far as I know) no one else in my genre (SF/F/H) uses that name.

If I wrote a book not in my usual genres, I might be forced to use a pseudonym, but it's not my first choice.

[dragonjax]

I'll be using a pseudonym for my YA writing -- which will actually be my maiden name. I don't want any YA readers to accidentally pick up my paranormal romance work, which is very (cough) spicy. So, married name for the stuff with s-e-x, and maiden name for the stuff meant for a younger audience.

[Sassenach]

My real name is Joyce Carol Oates, but I keep it under wraps, so that everyone here at AW treats me like a regular person.

[Siddow]

So far, I have published under my real name, but that's low-profile short stories. I would prefer to use my own name for any upcoming novels, but as I share a name with someone who has two pages of google hits before you even find a reference to ME, I really couldn't blame an agent or editor for suggesting I change it.

So my vote goes for: Keep my name if I can, willing to change it if asked.

[Perks]

I'm thinking about using a pen name for my first work, if only because I sometimes think the name Sean D. Schaffer is a boring name.

For what it's worth, I think it's a fine name. Mine's a bit countrified. I imagine people are surprised I don't drawl like Daisy Duke. Eh well.

[Alan Yee]

So far, I have published under my real name, but that's low-profile short stories. I would prefer to use my own name for any upcoming novels, but as I share a name with someone who has two pages of google hits before you even find a reference to ME, I really couldn't blame an agent or editor for suggesting I change it.

So my vote goes for: Keep my name if I can, willing to change it if asked.

I'm on the first page of a Google search for my name. Not sure whether that's a good thing or not.

[Sassenach]

Who can recomend? There are so many reasons to use a pen name and just as many not. I don't like my given name so I don't use it, ever. I've been JJ since I was 4 so I guess it is real even though it is not on my birth certificate. I've held to my name by using the initial and I use my real last name so is GJJWalter a pen name? And it is GJJWalter™, trademarked as is GJJW™ though, it seems pompous to write it that way except on a copyright page.



It sounds pompous [and other things] here as well. Or anywhere.

[SeanDSchaffer]

For what it's worth, I think it's a fine name. Mine's a bit countrified. I imagine people are surprised I don't drawl like Daisy Duke. Eh well.


Thanks!


I have, however, thought about using my first initial with my middle name, instead of my first name with my middle initial. I've also thought about changing my last name to Ian, which would result in the pseudonym S. Dennis Ian.

Part of the reason I don't much care for my own name is it sounds too uppety (sp?) for my own taste. I feel like my name belongs on a rich dude instead of on someone who was raised poor.

Whatever name I use, I definitely want it to sound catchy and be easy to pronounce.

[Silver King]

Sean, you're blessed with a wonderful name. It sounds so...authorly.

If I was faced with a pen name conundrum, and Montblanc was already chosen, I'd take beezle's advice and go with my two middle names.

Until I said them out loud just now, and realized no two words have ever coupled to produce a worse sound:

Ernest Claddy.

I know it’s awful in the extreme, though if any pen name searchers wish to use it, they’re more than welcome to take it on.

[scribbler1382]

I'm starting to lean towards Writer McWriterson.

[Sassenach]

Just call me Nora King Steel.

[Silver King]

GJJ, you've trademarked your name? I must've missed that point earlier.

I'm not so sure a name can be trademarked. Maybe I'm just thinking of titles, but for some reason, names come to mind as well.

Are you sure you'll be protected from infringement?

[Sassenach]

AHHhhh!! But think! Should anyone attempt to give me a bad review I can CHARGE them for using my name!


Anyway, point was, if your name is unique enough to get a trademark then why not. $250 well spent I'd say.

I'd love to hear Miss Snark's take on this.

[Jamesaritchie]

AHHhhh!! But think! Should anyone attempt to give me a bad review I can CHARGE them for using my name!


Anyway, point was, if your name is unique enough to get a trademark then why not. $250 well spent I'd say.

You are kidding, right? Even if you trademark your name, anyone else who wants to can still use it, even for writing books.

[Bubastes]

AHHhhh!! But think! Should anyone attempt to give me a bad review I can CHARGE them for using my name!


Anyway, point was, if your name is unique enough to get a trademark then why not. $250 well spent I'd say.

Ummmm....

IIRC, you also need to use the mark in interstate commerce to get federal trademark rights. Plus, IIRC, using your name a bad review would constitute using it in a non-trademark sense (there's no likelihood of confusion), so I'm puzzled as to how you could charge them for it.....

[Lolly]

I'll be using a pseudonym for my YA writing -- which will actually be my maiden name. I don't want any YA readers to accidentally pick up my paranormal romance work, which is very (cough) spicy. So, married name for the stuff with s-e-x, and maiden name for the stuff meant for a younger audience.

That's another good reason. I have ideas for various books, but they're not all in the same genre. I can just imagine some poor reader getting confused. "LB? Didn't I read a romance by that author? Then why does this book about mountain climbing have the same author?" :Huh:

[Bubastes]

Levity, Meow. It was just levity.


Thanks for the clarification. I need more catnip today.

[Horizon_eyes]

Madonna the singer has her name trademarked. She may still get bad reviews, but she's had her share of court fights! (Not about reviews per se but about others infringing her trademark)

The thing about names is that in some unions -- I don't know about writing unions yet, but I do know in the screen actors guild, you can't use someone else's name who is also a member. First come, first serve. In that industry though, it's hard to even be able to blow your nose without having to be in a union of some kind.

Outside of the industry though, when it comes to marketing using one's name, that's where a trademark comes in, such as making bobbleheads or something with that name perhaps. Even without one, there are still other laws that can protect you from someone else using your likeness and name for commercial purposes.

[Lolly]

The thing about names is that in some unions -- I don't know about writing unions yet, but I do know in the screen actors guild, you can't use someone else's name who is also a member. First come, first serve. In that industry though, it's hard to even be able to blow your nose without having to be in a union of some kind.



I've read that that's why Michael J. Fox put the initial in his name. When he first broke into the business, he found that there was already an actor named Michael Fox registered.

[Horizon_eyes]

Try using (or misusung) the name of an aggressive trademark owner like Sony™ in a "for profit" publication and see what happens.

Journalism is exempt however, even for-profit journalism. Any magazine, newspaper, television reporter, blog etc. can write an article about any product, trademark or not. So I would have to disagree with any sense of security that a trademark would protect one from being reviewed or even mentioned... But that's not to say it doesn't come without certain protections. The bottom line is, unless someone already has a run of publication success with a pen name, it could get expensive getting trademarks on each pen name until one finds one that works.

Patents, trademarks and copyrights are all means of various protection, but they are still very different with different laws.

[Jamesaritchie]

A Trademark is a protected name or logo that caries the same weight as a patent. (Mine is also a logo since it is written GJJWalter and not G. JJ Walter. ) Try using (or misusung) the name of an aggressive trademark owner like Sony™ in a "for profit" publication and see what happens.


The company that owns Velcro published a request that targeted writers for using velcro synonymously with loop and latch fasteners. They stated “It is Velcro™ and should be written as such…” They didn’t threaten to sue but mentioned they could.


While we are on the subject of protection, here is a cut and paste from Michael Crichton’s web page.

It means that Kobe Bryant may serve as an inspiration but not a model, because nobody can imitate him without fines. It means nobody can write a dinosaur story because my patent includes 257 items covering all aspects of behavior, like item No. 13, "Dinosaurs attack humans and other dinosaurs."

Such a situation is idiotic, of course. Yet elements of it already exist. And unless we begin to turn this around, there will be worse to come.


http://www.crichton-official.com/

It is scary.


How much are you depending on that little © symbol? What does ALL RIGHTS RESERVED mean to you?


Trademarking your name (if you can) is just a precaution. It gives you an edge if anyone uses your name in an improper or malicious manner. ® © ™ should be respected. Those that don’t could well be on a financial slay ride.


It all boils down to 2 lawyers and a judge. Go to McDonald's, pour coffee on yourself and then sue for 1.5 million. It HAPPENED. What does that have to do with the rest? NONE of it makes sense. Reason cannot apply.

Boy, are you out in left field. I really hope you aren't serious about all of this. It has to be a bad joke. In all honesty, you don't know very much about how trademarks work, and how they can and can't be used. And even less about patents, apparently.

I can't use the name Sony for another business that would make buyers think I was Sony. That's it. But I can use the name Sony all I wish for anything other than a business similar to theirs, and I can say or write anything I wish to say or write about Sony.

When writing nonfiction, I should include the trademark symbol, but when writing fiction I don't have to and they can't make me.

Just because you're using a name as a BUSINESS trademark, does not mean I can't use that name as a name.

Trademarking your name does not give you one extra bit of legal protection in any way, shape, or form. If you write a book, and you use the name, or the trademark, GJJWalter as the author of that book, anyone who wants to can still write a review saying that GJJWalter is a lousy writer, and shouldn't be allowed to write a grocery list without adult supervision.

Your right to trademark your name does not nullify someone else's right of free speech.

I can also say I think Sony stinks, and makes the worst products of any company in the world, and there isn't a thing they can do about it.

And you should keep up with the law. The Supreme Court dismissed the case Crichton talks about, ruling that neither ideas nor information can be patented, and that no patent prohibits anyone from saying or writing anything, and that no patent may ever do so.

And just because something receives a patent doesn't mean a thing. Patents only legally cover processes, and then only if that proces has never been used before, OR HAS NEVER BEFORE APPEARED IN PRINT. If such a patent is granted, it is automatically voided under the law.

By law, no idea can be patented, and the courts have long since ruled that shuld such a patent be issued, it is not a legal patent. And, of course, even if you could patent an idea, which you can't, any dinosaur story or plot written before your patent would automatically make your patent worthless because you can't patent something that's already been done. Nor may patent law interfere with copyright law, or free speech protection.

And a trademark only covers a specific use of a name or a term, and even intent to use does not protect something. Until you are actually using that trademark in a manner that trademarks are intended to be used for, you have no protection. And after you are using it, people can say anything they wish about you, your company, or your trademark. The only think they can't do is use the same trademark in the same way you use it, which in this case would be covered by plagiarism laws, not trademark law.

As for what "ALL RIGHTS RESERVED means to me, it means the same thing it does to the courts. Not a thing most of the time. When it does have meaning, it means only that no one can use my creation in an illegal manner, or take away the rights to that creation that I own. But having a trademark does not mean you own the right not to have anyone talk bad about you, or to write bad things about you, or to use a trademark in any way not specified under the law.

As for the MacDonald's suit, it boils down to what a jury says, and as stupid as the jury decision was, it was a legal decision. There was never any question about this. But what it has to do with anything is beyond me.

[Sesselja]

Thanks for the lecture.

(And no, that wasn't meant to be sarcastic.)

[Horizon_eyes]

I would concur with Jamesaritchie... There's a handful of companies that use the name Delta, all with different products.

As for mentioning someone else's name, there's a lot of room before someone can cry 'slander'. It's legal to call someone a liar, a jerk, say their product sucks, and even 'horse's ***', believe it or not, because those phrases have been won in court as personal opinions that can be shared with the world at large if someone chooses to do so. Case in point, "paypalsucks.com", a site devoted to criticizing PayPal, and has been operating legally for years.

Even a Google search for "sony sucks" and "hate sony" is pretty enlightening how legal it is to 'mention' sony. The only thing I can't do is start making DVD players, stamp them "sony", and sell them.

I'm not trying to beat a dead horse, honestly. I do want to help make a distinction though, for the sake of writers on here like me weighing the necessity of pen names, and all that may or may not be needed to go with it. A trademark though -- still not sure I see the necessity for it early in one's writing career until a name has been established that works in the industry.

[Jamesaritchie]

I would concur with Jamesaritchie... There's a handful of companies that use the name Delta, all with different products.

As for mentioning someone else's name, there's a lot of room before someone can cry 'slander'. It's legal to call someone a liar, a jerk, say their product sucks, and even 'horse's ***', believe it or not, because those phrases have been won in court as personal opinions that can be shared with the world at large if someone chooses to do so. Case in point, "paypalsucks.com", a site devoted to criticizing PayPal, and has been operating legally for years.

Even a Google search for "sony sucks" and "hate sony" is pretty enlightening how legal it is to 'mention' sony. The only thing I can't do is start making DVD players, stamp them "sony", and sell them.

I'm not trying to beat a dead horse, honestly. I do want to help make a distinction though, for the sake of writers on here like me weighing the necessity of pen names, and all that may or may not be needed to go with it. A trademark though -- still not sure I see the necessity for it early in one's writing career until a name has been established that works in the industry.

And try Googling Wal-Mart. Talk about a company that gets ten times its share of rotten comments!

[AncientEagle]

My real name is Joyce Carol Oates, but I keep it under wraps, so that everyone here at AW treats me like a regular person.

I knew it! I knew it!

I'd still treat you like a regular person, but anyone making such a long commute to Princeton can hardly be considered regular.

[Silver King]

Thanks for the lecture.

(And no, that wasn't meant to be sarcastic.)
We're fortunate Mr. Ritchie cares enough to weigh in. I've seen him debate this topic before, and in every instance, including this one, not a single person was able to prove him wrong.

As a side note, what's going on with the declining font size in some of these posts?

[Jamesaritchie]

I knew it! I knew it!

I'd still treat you like a regular person, but anyone making such a long commute to Princeton can hardly be considered regular.

I'm disappointed. Last I knew, Joyce Carol Oates didn't own a word processor, and never visited forums. She's gone over to the dark side.

[C.bronco]

I had a pen named Irv. He ran out of ink. The next pen name I bestow will be Betty. She is a reliable black Bic, perfect for any occasion.

[Silver King]

Hey, C., I had you beat a while ago, twice in fact, with my reference to Montblanc. And I managed to add something useful, albeit miniscule, to the discussion at hand.

I'm afraid your Bic is seriously outclassed. Did you even bother to read the thread before posting?

[Silver King]

In any case, my point was simply if you can then why not trademark.
If it serves no purpose, then why do it in the first place?

Your argument has lost most of its steam, and I hope this means you've seen the light, so to speak. (Mr. Ritchie has that effect on people sometimes.)

[beezle]

If I named my pens, I'd feel guilty about chewing them.

[Jamesaritchie]

I agree, patent, trademark, copyright, none of it is necessarily useful because the laws are all gray scale. For any successful litigation there is another unsuccessful.

Though, any “for profit” unauthorized use of a trademark can be argued that the profit should be shared. “for profit” is such a general term that any use of a trademark might be cleverly included. And it is not for sake of profit that generally develops into infringement cases, but malice.

And no, you cannot say anything you want about someone. Freedom of speech stops at slander/liable. “I think Jamesaritchie is a liar” is not litigable whereas “Jamesaritchie is a liar” is.

In any case, my point was simply if you can then why not trademark.

As for left field, all those examples are from left field. You got to keep you eye on that field. It can bite you.

But what the heck. Screw the trademark. There is no justice in the world anyway. This has become tedious.

Saying I'm is a liar is only litigable if I can prove you knew I wasn't a liar and said it anyway. And then I must prove my reputation or my business suffered demonstrable damages from your statement. If I can't prove both of these things, I have no case.

Libel and slander are very difficultt to prove because a statement alone is not litigable, regardless of what that statement is. There must also be intent to harm, reasonable belief that the statement you make is false, and then actual, demonstrable harm to reputation or business.

As for unauthorized use of a trademark, yes, that can result in damages. But trademark rights are very limited, and there are all sorts of ways people can use your trademark in a legal manner without the need for your authorization.

[Horizon_eyes]

Well it's been a while but just as an update I have since decided on -- and started using a 'pseudoname'. It's actually one I'm using for my stage acting work and a band that I'm in. And, it's probably the name I'll end up using for the book I'm [still] working on.

The entire discussion here has been most enlightening... http://www.absolutewrite.com/forums/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ClaudiaGray]

"Claudia Gray" isn't my real name. I would like to say that I had an deeply felt or at least market-driven reason for taking a pen name, but I don't; the whole reason I did this was because, even back when I was a little kid with no real thought of writing anything, I thought the idea of a pen name was, well, neat.

More practically, I still hope to write and sell in more than one genre in my career, which means I'd be taking a pen name of some sort eventually. I figure I might as well start with a pen name so I don't have some books out there with my real name on them and others without.

[Captain Morgan]

Well sorry I wasn’t around to contribute my 2 cents to this earlier.

Myself I thought people who don’t use pen names were rather shallow. Let’s face it, pen names have been around for hundreds of years, are still around in large numbers, and will still be around tomorrow. For good reason!

Now yes, even Actors use pen names, and while this may not prevent stalkers from chasing you, it does add a little bit of protection and anonymity.

Myself I’ve noticed when we are young (and dumb) we tend to think life is all about being rich & famouse. What child DOESN’T want to be rich & famouse? But as we get older I think the famouse part starts to drop out once people actually succeed at it. It’s nice that people want your autograph and all. But after many years of having to fakley smile, do this or that for every passer-by, put up with hate-mail and all the other problems… charity beggars, stalkers, and everyone just bothering you even when standing in front of the urinal with your phallus grabbed in your hand, enough starts to be enough. They start to wish they had their anonymity back like a regular person. But by then it’s rather too late to turn back.

Though I think we all will appreciate being rich, no matter how rich we may get! But that’s mostly a pipedream.

The type of writer I don’t really respect are those who are all about me. Me-me-me. Do you know who I am? I am so and so! I wrote this book! It has my name on it! And I’m going on a talk show to promote my book, with my picture on the back! The world is full of self-promoters and while many of them are famouse, I couldn’t really care less about them.

Anyhow, it seems those who really should be using Pen names the most, are not. For example, look at PublishAmerica books. They are filled with young-gun authors who feel that “wow I just got my book accepted!” They feel they have hit it big now and shortly will be famouse. They are so happy to slap their real name onto the book and can’t wait for their relatives, friends, and total strangers to come by and buy THEIR book! They can’t wait to be the center of attention of the world.

Fast forward a decade from then, when the reality hits them that not only were the scammed, but their writing was so horrible that even if they do become a successful writer with a credible book and publisher, that skeleton is going to be stuck in that closet haunting them. They’ll be always thinking ‘My god, I signed my name onto that piece of crap!’

However, as many will tell you, trying to educate people when their ego takes over is like talking to a patriot. Logic is thrown out the window…

[Horizon_eyes]

Very wise words, Captain.

I think one thing to overcome for anyone considering a pen name, especially if they live in a medium-sized home town that's not LA or NY, is feeling 'silly' among family and friends. That's something I had to endure getting mine used to the idea of a stage name for my performance venues. Had to go through the subtle remarks like 'You don't need a stage name', said in the context of 'do you think you're so special that you need a stage name' kinda thing.

It's not about who I am now, but who I'm pursuing to become.

A name -- whether a stage name or pen name, is your brand. And it's one you've got to protect from the likes of Publish America and other scams, like you wisely pointed out. Not to mention that down the road, pen names can also be changeable in case irreparable damage occurs.

[IrishScribbler]

I've only just caught up on reading this thread; I apologize for my tardiness.

I've been weighing the idea of using a pen name. If I do use one, it'll be Nicole Roscrea. (Roscrea is the Irish town from which my family came. Nicole is my real name.)

I think my uncertainty comes in that I don't want to seem as though I'm not claiming my real self, if that makes sense. Really, it has nothing to do with that. I just think my real name--or what will be my name when I get married--sounds a bit awkward: Nicole Palmby.

Input?

[stormie]

For the past seven years, I haven't used a pen name. Will I someday? Doubtful, but maybe. I've learned never to say never.

[FredCharles]

I use a pen name. My pen name is my real first and middle name. I'm not sure that I would write under a totally different name.

[Captain Morgan]

Often one thing you end up with, is writers who have pen names that get their pen name so famous, that they have to resort to using other pen names again!

While that would not be so much a bad problem to have, sometimes I am suspicions of such things.

For example, Mr. Best Seller who is well known, ends up writing another book, under yet another Pen name. Perhaps he is worried that only his name is selling his work and he feels he wants to test if his writing is good enough to lure people to his books on it's own merrit.

In just about all these cases the sales really drop off. That's just the way it goes, and proves a point that a lot of books are sold on name-sake, not quality.

However, often something will be leaked to the public regarding who is behind the name, and tadahhh... Drum Roll please... Sales suddenly increase like mad.

Maybe the info got leaked by accident, or maybe the author did it on purpose to try and save face for himself. Though I don't doubt a lot of times the publisher itself may leak the info. Reason being? They are in it for the money. Poor sales = poor income. It is their job try to and sell as many books as possible, and make the profit.

So again, I always get suspicious when I hear "So and so has a new book coming out, but there is a rumour it's really written by another so-and-so! Now I just HAVE to buy it! They thought they'd pull the wool over our eyes, but I'm going to get his book now and no fooling me!"

The general public runs over to the sales stand and pre-orders their copies ASAP thinking how clever they were to get ahold of the rumour and turn the tables on the writer/publisher. I really think it is the other way around in these cases.

[Sassenach]

I've only just caught up on reading this thread; I apologize for my tardiness.

I've been weighing the idea of using a pen name. If I do use one, it'll be Nicole Roscrea. (Roscrea is the Irish town from which my family came. Nicole is my real name.)

I think my uncertainty comes in that I don't want to seem as though I'm not claiming my real self, if that makes sense. Really, it has nothing to do with that. I just think my real name--or what will be my name when I get married--sounds a bit awkward: Nicole Palmby.

Input?

I have no idea how to pronounce Roscrea, but Palmby is relatively easy.

[Kristin Landon]

This is terribly awful, but my eye wants to read "Roscrea" as "Rosacea," as in the skin condition. It's a perfectly nice name, but my brain is messing with it. I'm sorry—I thought I'd better mention it, because I may not be the only one. (Or maybe I am; I copyedit medical books.)

I've never considered using a pen name. Having my real name out there gives me a flutter of concern from time to time, but overall I'm more comfortable keeping it simple. Fortunately my name is simple, too.

[Croque Madame]

I opted to go with a pen name because there is a a porn star who shares my (birth)name. No idea if it's her birth name or her stage name, but I didn't really want that association!

[Shady Lane]

I don't, but sometimes I think that I should. My last name is very long and Jewish, and I since since I usually have biblical themes in my writing the immense Jewishness of my name might have a connotation I don't want.

But I'm too egotistical to do it.

[aruna]

I wonder if anyone ever started out with a pen name and then regretted it later; or started out with their real name and wished they hadn't.



I do regret it. I was practically talked into it by my publisher. If and when I get published again I would like to use my real maiden name, the one I originally wanted, but then readers won't be able to connect me to my previous books: damn!

In my later years I want to branch into non-fiction and I already have my pen name picked for that.

[aruna]

I just think my real name--or what will be my name when I get married--sounds a bit awkward: Nicole Palmby.

Input?

have to admit - I immediately thought of "namby-pamby".
What about Nicola Palm? That has a nice ring to it. Palm trees have pleasant associations.

[aruna]

The sad truth is that etnicity is a real factor in why people often decide upon a book .... 2 of the same books with the same title in 2 seperate stores may do very diffrently in sales if one was authored by "JACK STEEL" and one listed under tyhe name "osama muhhamed"


I agree with you. And in retrospect, I should have chosen an Indian pen name for my first batch of books, because they are mostly set in India and have a strong Indian flavour. The first one came out just before India became "hot". (It started with Arundhati Roy's God of Small Things and Vikram Seth's A Suitable Boy) and Indian writers were overnight the Next Big Thing. But I used a Western name, and missed a good chance to be part of that wave.

[swvaughn]

I like pen names. Got two of them, myself. I write in different genres and I'm trying to separate them -- keeping the whole brand thing in mind.

In fact, I've been using pen names for so long that I almost feel wrong using my real name for my latest stuff. My agent suggested it, because I explained that I'd taken S. W. Vaughn for the thrillers since they are dark and violent and (I've been told) manly, but the novel(s) she's working with have a female protag... and I guess Sonya isn't a bad name. At least most people know how to pronounce it.

Then again, nothing says "it's all about the writing" like a pen name. :D I've always wanted it to be all about the writing, and not about me.

[Raphee]

If I ever get to being published, I'll use my real name. No ego involved.

[IrishScribbler]

If I ever get to being published, I'll use my real name. No ego involved.

If? We should be more optimistic! When you get published!

[ClaudiaGray]

This is terribly awful, but my eye wants to read "Roscrea" as "Rosacea," as in the skin condition. It's a perfectly nice name, but my brain is messing with it. I'm sorry—I thought I'd better mention it, because I may not be the only one. (Or maybe I am; I copyedit medical books.)



Actually, I thought that too.

[IrishScribbler]

Thanks for the input on the name, everyone!

[AllieB]

FWIW, I decided to use a pen name because I kept my maiden name when I got married for professional reasons. My hubby's been so supportive in my writing endeavors that I wanted to use his last name for my books. It also provides some anonymity, yes. Plus, my maiden name is a very, very common one.

Finally, my pen name is much closer to the beginning of the alphabet - meaning on author rolls and on the shelves, it is closer to the start. Perhaps a superficial thought, but when it comes to marketing and promotion, anything helps.

[jnesvold]

I write short stories for online under a pen name, and try to keep my youth-oriented writings separate from my adult-oriented writings with pen names.

[Danger Jane]

I'm not sure what I'll do when the time comes...I hate my last name, which is Hoffman...probably I'd use a family name instead, and my own first name, which I like, even though it's anachronistic for anyone my age. There are just a lot of authors with my last name.

[Turtle07]

I haven't published anything yet, but I'll be using a pen name!! Uh...u use it for fun????? And the mystery of being a writer!!! I mean, how many greta authors used pen names? Lemony Snicket, Mark Twain, Jane Austin (until she was found out that she was a girl). See???

[NicoleMD]

FWIW, I decided to use a pen name because I kept my maiden name when I got married for professional reasons.

I totally read this incorrectly. I was really intrigued to find out what your professional reasons for getting married were. ;)

Nicole

[AllieB]

Ha! now *that* would be a good premise for a story, right? :)

[Horizon_eyes]

Well, there was the movie Indecent Proposal...

[Raphee]

If? We should be more optimistic! When you get published!

True words. The glass is still half full, since I havent made any submissions.
I am going to put your words on my signature line next week. Need to decide if I am going to kill this damn character or let him live.

[Sassenach]

Finally, my pen name is much closer to the beginning of the alphabet - meaning on author rolls and on the shelves, it is closer to the start. Perhaps a superficial thought, but when it comes to marketing and promotion, anything helps.

I've heard this for years, but still don't believe it. Steel, Roberts & Rowling have done ok.

[Kristin Landon]

I suppose that if your name begins with A you have a fair chance of always being on an eye-level shelf, but for everyone else it's going to vary from store to store and from month to month.

[Thump]

I'm seriously considering a pen name since my name consists of a name and surname of different ethnicities plus my given name might be difficult to pronounce. I've had people mangle it often. It's not even that complicated!
My surname is the most common hispanic surname ever so it wouldn't make me memorable either.

I don't know what it would be but I think I'd go for something androgynous and cool. I write SFF and YA btw :) Naturally, I would rather see my own name on the cover but I understand that if I want to succeed, a pen name might help a lot. It sounds shallow but even I tend not to read an author if their name is John S. Smith :S

[Lady Esther]

I will use my nickname as my pen name. I can count, with my fingers, the number of people who have pronounced my birth name correctly. Only my family and close friends know my birth name, so I see no point in using it when my book is published.

Fantasy authors usually use their initials, i.e. J.R.R. Tolkein, C.S. Lewis, J.K. Rowling, T.A. Barron.

Maybe I should be J.A. Cato to keep up with the Joneses.

[Aprylwriter]

I like my name, and I am probably going to use that instead of a pen name. My first name is interesting enough so that it stands out, and my last name is easy to remember.

I have one author friend who has two different pen names and he is thinking about getting a third one lol. If I had that many, I would be totally confused.

(my name really is Apryl, by the way-it's not a pen name or a typo.)

[maddythemad]

About the whole "beginning of the alphabet being better" thing-- I'm sure this is unusual, but at our local Barnes and Noble they have this weird thing where the novels by authors with last names A-C are shelved with the nonfiction. It took me months to figure out that they even had those novels, and I'm sure some people have never found them. Basically, I don't think there's any surefire way to guarantee that your book will have prime shelf space.

[freshpencils]

Yes, Horizon, good point.

I use a pen name for privacy reasons. I want to be rich (I WILL be rich!), but not famous. Living in a fishbowl is not for me.

[freshpencils]

Aruna - That's so true about Indian writers! They're on fire right now. And, boy, they've written some fantastic books. "The Namesake," for one. (That's being made into a movie, hope they don't mess it up.) Also, "A Fine Balance."

[freshpencils]

Pen names can be fun, I think. I use a combination of family names, but at one time I came up with a few pen names that just slide off the tongue and sound very "readable." I'm keeping them in reserve in case I need them.

[freshpencils]

See, now, I think Ernest Claddy is perfect. Who could forget that?

You're in earnest and claddy in warm wool, curled up by the fire reading.

[Lolly]

Yes, Horizon, good point.

I use a pen name for privacy reasons. I want to be rich (I WILL be rich!), but not famous. Living in a fishbowl is not for me.


Great point! I would love to have Dan Brown's money, but I don't want to be hounded everywhere I go like some Hollywood celebrity. I'm also writing stuff that's fairly controversial, so I don't want some nut who disagrees with me tracking me down to give me his views--or worse.

And besides, it's fun being another person. Remember when you were a kid, playing games like "house" or "cowboys & indians"? :tongue I'm having fun trying to think of a creative name.

[ccarver30]

I don't use one (as far as sending queries and junk goes [because I am not published]) but I have one I would use. I'm not telling what it is! ;)

[mscelina]

I actually have a pen name or three. I use them to keep my genre and/or fiction/nonfiction work separate. My current favorite is my erotica pseudonym. *grin* I purposely selected the last name of my least favorite coach in all of college football so that when he googles himself (and I know he does) my name will come up. I'm so bad. :D

[Tasmin21]

Originally, I wanted to publish under my maiden name for the petty purpose of rubbing everyone's nose in it. (y'know, all those mean kids in school)

Then, I got married, shed the admittedly atrocious maiden name, and grew up a lot. ;) I'll probably publish my fantasy stuff under my real name, because it's fairly innocuous and I doubt I'll get many stalkers.

However, if I ever get up the guts to work on my erotica (I write for fun and friends now, not for publication), THEN I'll most definitely choose a pen name.

[job]

You don't need an excuse to use a pen name.
You can do it just cause you want to.

When you submit to an agent or editor, you use your regular name. You do all the initial correspondance in your real name. The manuscript has your real name on it.
You don't even have to mention you want to use a pen name till you already have an agent. Then you two can discuss it.

Early in the publication process the editor will check the exact form and spelling of your name or pen name. You don't have to tack it down till then.

[ErylRavenwell]

Do I have a pen name? I'm having a hard time choosing between Staedler, Bic and Pentel. ;)

[JJ Cooper]

I would like to use my kids names. Jayden (JJ) and Cooper. Man they have got a cool Dad.

JJ Cooper

[justpat]

Mine is Mortoff Schnigorp. Kinda rolls off the tongue, don't it? Seriously, farwalkers.com (http://farwalkers.com/authors.php)

[Steve W]

Hi,

I've toyed with a pen name simply because I don't like my surname. I can't see any problem with doing that, in fact the pros out weigh the cons as far as I can see. Look at other areas of entertainment -- acting, music. Do actors have any qualms at all about using something they consider better?

I say go for it.

Cheers,
Steve

[JoNightshade]

So far I've just been using my maiden name, because it's the name I started my "career" (haha) with and I wanted to be consistent. It's kind of hard to explain in a query letter, "Oh, I published these short stories under this name, but then I got married and now I'm using this name," etc.

However I have toyed with the idea of using a male pseudonym if/when I ever get one of my novels published. This is purely because-- and this is my own personal failing-- when I'm browsing, I am reluctant to pick up books written by women. I realize that this is horrible for a woman to say, but it's true. All of my favorite authors are male, except George Eliot-- who went by a male pseudonym! It's not that I don't read books by women, because I do, but at the end of the day for some reason about 90% of the ones I like best are male. In general, I just find that a lot of women writers are very gushy or overly emotional and I don't like that.

Then on the other hand, a female writer friend of mine said that I should stick with my own name because it's important to show that women writers can produce good stuff. I think she has a point. We'll see.

[Richard White]

Currently, what little SF/F I have published has all been under my real name. However, if I ever get around to writing this little crime noir novel (been channelling a lot of Dashell Hammett these days), I'll publish that under a pen name. Same thing if I get this historical writing assignment.

You know it's like General Motors - One brand for Sports Cars, one brand for SUVs and one brand for sedans. :)

[Red Robin]

I'm thinking of using a pen name (optimism is great)

My first name seems to be unpronounceable for people from the Mediterranean region.

My second name is a common Gaelic name, which people often Americanize.

My last name is German, and is consistently misspelled and mispronounced.

Hence...

[Sean D. Schaffer]

Snipped...

My last name is German, and is consistently misspelled and mispronounced.

Hence...


I know the feeling. There must be a dozen different ways of spelling 'Schaffer'. In fact, my browser insists I'm misspelling my own name as I write this post.

*Sigh*

I don't use a pen name myself, simply because my creativity gets the best of me and I end up making some fantastical name that no one will ever be able to pronounce. Also, I use my real name because I frankly want to see my own name on the front of a book.

I just hope I don't end up regretting my decision.

[Lolly]

However I have toyed with the idea of using a male pseudonym if/when I ever get one of my novels published. This is purely because-- and this is my own personal failing-- when I'm browsing, I am reluctant to pick up books written by women. I realize that this is horrible for a woman to say, but it's true. All of my favorite authors are male, except George Eliot-- who went by a male pseudonym! It's not that I don't read books by women, because I do, but at the end of the day for some reason about 90% of the ones I like best are male. In general, I just find that a lot of women writers are very gushy or overly emotional and I don't like that.

Then on the other hand, a female writer friend of mine said that I should stick with my own name because it's important to show that women writers can produce good stuff. I think she has a point. We'll see.


Hmmmm, maybe we should start another thread on this subject? Because I actually share your sentiments. It's nothing against my own sex, just my personality. Women tend to write romances, chick-lit, and "soft" kind of books. I tend to like factual stuff such as biographies and history. The exception to this rule is SF. There are women who write SF that I really enjoy reading.

As for me, I'm still thinking of what name to choose. My middle name is gender neutral, so I could just use that and let people make their own assumptions. (I've actually done that when publishing other stuff.)

[gem1122]

In a grad school fiction workshop, there was this female student who was always trying out different names. Mostly, they were versions of her own name, like using the first and middle name initials. Sometimes, they were completely different.

I found her to be a conceited pain in the ass.

I wouldn't consider a pseudonym, but I have thought about using the first and middle name initial thing. I have a famous person's name, and unless I use my full name, or insert my middle initial, or something else, I know it would be very confusing when I start selling millions of copies. ;)

But I swear I'm not a conceited pain in the ass.

[Dave.C.Robinson]

One thing that can help is using something like the name with initial for one genre, and without for another. This is particularly good when one genre sells more than another and you don't want books in that genre to drag down orders for ones in the other.

Just a thought.