Neurodiversity in YA?

Nogetsune · Apr 27, 2012

As the title asks. I myself have two mental "disabilities" and would absolutly love to write a story with an MC who shares one or both of the conditions I have, yet I have worries about doing it. On one hand, it's something I'd love to write and share with others, since it could both give teens what I have a fictional hero they can look up too and empathize with, but yet at the same time my story has to appeal to those without any mental disabilities if it has any hopes of selling, and thats what worries me. The focus of the story as it is now is NOT the character's disabilities. It is a story about war, the evils of the millitary industrial complex, magic, dragons, and all kinds of other exciting things in addition to the MC overcomming the issues relating to his condition(s). It is an action-packed story with lots of fighting and magic, it has content that appeals to everybody.

However, my fear is that, despite the fact the story is so much more then just the MC's mental disability and struggles with it, that the mere fact that the MC has it will make it hard to market and publish since, well, most of the world, and thus most YA readers are "neurotypical" and as a result I fear publishers may say that my MC is not "normal" enough for the neurotypical YA reader aka the majority of YA readers. I know that the Percy Jackson series featured a MC with ADHD and dyslexia and was pretty popular, even among readers without those "disabilities" so am I may be worrying for nothing, but I still want to see your opinions on the situation.

My MC would have, among other things, Aspergers' Syndrome(which is a high functioning form of autisim that I myself have, hence my desire to write an MC with it.), and as a result I fear that if I one day try to get this thing published that publishers will either say that my MC is not "normal" enough for the average YA reader OR that they would try to market the work as a very, very niche' novel about the struggles of a teen with Aspergers' and forget all about the fantasy/si-fi elements and political themes that are just as important as the MC's struggles with his personal issues. So, as a result, I want to know, what do you know, if anything, about these concerns? Would a "non-neurotypical" MC be hated by publishers even if the story is good or are publishers open to such MCs?

Any thoughts on these concerns or the general state of neurodiversity in YA would be greatly appreciated.

KateSmash · Apr 27, 2012

Going to have to break out the old line of "they will buy anything if it's written well."

Obviously there will be some editors that will see a non-neurotypical MC as a problem and ask you to change it. Odds are your agent (if they're worth their salt) will know that these are the wrong editors to shop your manuscript to. I'm willing to be their are just as many publishers (Tu Books springs immediately to mind) that will jump on the opportunity. Let's face it, a non-neurotypical MC is a pretty good way to get an agent/editor to look at a query that might otherwise be skimmed.

Now, as a reader and a neurotypical person, I want you to write this. I want to read it. One of the best ways to learn and empathize with people unlike yourself is through fiction. A MC with Aspbergers' would be a selling point because, I hate to admit, I really don't know much about it. And the media doesn't portray it very well.

It doesn't mean I want the book to be a primer on the disorder. A good book should tell a great story above all else. But you might have to put a bit more info into it than you think you might. That can always come up in the context of the story though, and really shouldn't worry about it unless a few betas bring it up.

So ... yeah. Write it. Write it well. It's horribly underrepresented (to the point where I can't think of any titles beyond mental illness (a la depression and eating disorders)). Worry about selling it later.

Stiger05 · Apr 27, 2012

I'll start out by giving the advice you're likely to hear anytime you ask a question like this: write the story you want to write.

Don't worry whether publishers will want it, or how they will market it. You don't have any control over either of those. Write your story first and be true to your characters. If your character is shy, they're shy. If they're talkative, they're talkative. If your character has Asperger's, he has Asperger's. Write your character.

That being said, I don't see this as an issue. There are books where the MC has mental disabilities. You pointed out Percy Jackson, there's also "Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close" where the MC has Autism and possibly Asperger's. I think it's an underrepresented category, but I don't think readers would have a problem reading about someone with these issues. I have moderate to severe OCD (and possibly mild Asperger's, although I haven't been diagnosed- mostly because I hate doctors and have refused to go, but I digress) and have a WIP with an OCD character. I think it's good to draw attention to these things for the reasons you pointed out.

If this is the story you want to write, write it. Don't worry about anything else.

auriel · Apr 27, 2012

If it makes sense to the story, go for it. I think if anything, it would make your work stand out as having an interesting MC. There would have to be a balance, I think, between the MC's struggling with his internal issues vs. the outside conflict - if you lean too much towards one or the other, the whole book would feel like an "issue" book.

The only thing I'm worried about is that the Aspberger's - a very real world problem - in the middle of story that involves magic and dragons. There might be an off-putting disparity when putting these two worlds together. I was going to point out "Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close" as well - just finished reading it and it was fascinating and, I think, really well done. (though not YA.)

There's no harm in writing it. I, personally, find reading about "non-neurotypical" MCs very interesting. But I can't speak for publishers/agents/anyone else.

Smish · Apr 27, 2012

Marcelo in the Real World springs immediately to mind, though I haven't read it, yet. I've been meaning to read it for awhile now, so thanks for reminding me to get to that one soon. :Thumbs:

lilysea · Apr 27, 2012

The fact that there aren't many books out there with neurodiverse characters means we need more books with neurodiverse characters. So heck yeah, write that book!

I was just saying on the sexual orientation in YA thread that people don't necessarily want to read about character exactly like themselves. In fact, many of us look to fiction to learn about things we couldn't know much about in our own "real" worlds.

Spectrum "disorders" (pardon me) are a growing reality (as you know) and many people are very interested in them and in people who have them. I think there is plenty of fodder for all kinds of stories featuring people with neuro-differences, especially on the autism spectrum. Besides people who are on the spectrum themselves, you have their families and friends and partners who are also interested in A) learning more about the experience and B) seeing more representation of people on the spectrum in the culture at large.

Someone here has a signature that quotes Toni Morrison saying "if you can't find the book you want to read, write it."

Do it! Do. It.

courtneyv · Apr 27, 2012

The one thing I would hate if I had a neurological disorder is books always being centered around that and having nothing more to the story. Like, my son was struggling with reading so I was looking for kids books FOR dyslexics, with their brains in mind, that have pictures maybe with the words, rhymes and/or the words that kids typically mix up, but I kept coming across books for kids ABOUT dyslexia, as if kids want to continually read about their struggle. Sure.

I think your idea is marvelous because handling stress is much different for a person on the spectrum and it would give the story greater dimension to see how the conflict is resolved in spite of the emotional and social challenges he/she has to deal with. With autism being so prevalent, it's about time fiction reflects this in a span of genres.

Sage · Apr 27, 2012

Marcelo in the Real World and Harmonic Feedback deal with Asperger's.

In Bleeding Violet, a contemp fantasy, the MC is bipolar.

Cyia · Apr 27, 2012

Harmonic Feedback was my first thought, as was The Curious Incident of the Dog in Nighttime.

You'll find there are several members of this board who are diagnosed AS, too. So don't feel like you're the only one out there trying to write with it.

thebloodfiend · Apr 27, 2012

I say go for it. Hell, if you can make them non-white males, that's be a plus, too. Whenever I see non neurotical characters, they're always written in the vein of Sheldon on BBT.

missesdash · Apr 27, 2012

I also think there's a difference between writing an aspie MC and someone with, say, Borderline Personality Disorder.

People with Aspergers or with experience with it will be able to identify it, but everyone else will assume these aspects of your character are personality quirks. I think it's sort of like not stating a character is nonwhite, most people will default on white.

Not many people can put together the symptoms of a characters behavior and say "oh I get it, she's bipolar." They'll say "wow, she is kind of crazy" or "what a drama queen." Aspies are generally assumed to be "lovable weirdos"

So in that vein, I don't think you need to worry about the character not being "normal" enough. Neurodiversity is a lot easier to pitch, I'd think than physically disabled MC's. In theory your character wouldn't make that many references to being an aspie, so it's not as ever present (again, to those who don't recognize it) as someone physically disabled.

Just some thoughts

Rufus Coppertop · Apr 27, 2012

Ryukami said:
The focus of the story as it is now is NOT the character's disabilities. It is a story about war, the evils of the millitary industrial complex, magic, dragons, and all kinds of other exciting things in addition to the MC overcomming the issues relating to his condition(s). It is an action-packed story with lots of fighting and magic, it has content that appeals to everybody.

From what the little I know about Asperger's, it seems that in many cases it can be a blessing rather than a curse.

People with Asperger's can have a unique approach to things that others don't necessarily have. What if this MC's way of seeing things enables him to find a counterintuitive (for "normals") way of fighting the bad guys which turns out to be surprisingly effective.

Stiger05 · Apr 27, 2012

missesdash said:
People with Aspergers or with experience with it will be able to identify it, but everyone else will assume these aspects of your character are personality quirks.

I would be careful with this. Most people think I'm just quirky and don't realize from normal interaction what I go through internally. OP, I'm sure you know what I mean being an aspie. My OCD, for example, isn't of the flipping a light switch 40 times variety that people obviously see, but things like I can't leave a building a different way from how I entered. If I feel pressure on one side of my body, I have to recreate it on the other. I can't turn in full circles and people can't touch my ears. Everything has to be in even numbers (there's much more, but hopefully you get the idea). These are things people who know me well notice, but others think are quirks. "Oh, she has to have the radio volume on an even number and eats M&Ms in pairs."

If you're going to do it, I think you need to be sure and highlight it without making it the focus. Maybe even something as simple as having the MC overhear one character telling another "he has Asperger's" might do.

ETA: I'm just now getting to where I can talk about these things and say the words out loud. What point is your MC at? Does he acknowledge his afflictions or is he still running from them? Just a thought.

Becca C. · Apr 27, 2012

I say go for it. My seventeen-year-old brother was recently diagnosed with Asperger's, so I would be interested in reading it.

That said, make sure it doesn't feel like a gimmick. "All the usual fantasy fare -- with an aspie MC so it's totally unique!!!" I'm sure you wouldn't do that, but sometimes twists on "the norm" can feel out-of-place if they aren't written right.

Cyia · Apr 27, 2012

missesdash said:
.

People with Aspergers or with experience with it will be able to identify it, but everyone else will assume these aspects of your character are personality quirks.

This is why I think the *best* neurodiverse characters on TV are those who aren't specified as such - like Bones, House, and the cop that used to be on Law&Order (Vincent DiNoffrio).

Stiger05 said:
I can't turn in full circles and people can't touch my ears. Everything has to be in even numbers (there's much more, but hopefully you get the idea). These are things people who know me well notice, but others think are quirks. "Oh, she has to have the radio volume on an even number and eats M&Ms in pairs."

For me, it's odd numbers, no touching my sides or stomach, and organizing crayon/colored pencils into a specific order. (purple with brown, blue with green, etc)

If your character's comfortable with himself, you can show him wearing a "Spock's an Aspie, too" T-shirt, or some such.

Rufus Coppertop · Apr 27, 2012

Stiger05 said:
I can't leave a building a different way from how I entered. If I feel pressure on one side of my body, I have to recreate it on the other.

Uh oh!

GingerGunlock · Apr 27, 2012

I've seen YA that has neurodiverse characters in it, so it can certainly be done! The Perks of Being a Wallflower comes to mind (though that's probably my own interpretation, that it's a rewrite of Flowers for Algernon, with autism, as nothing is spelled out, actually.) There's another one that specifically addresses NT versus neurodiverse, and I can't think of what it's called. It had a blue cover. Hmm.

But anyway, do it. Write it as true as you can, and worry about shopping it after. Do your research on precedent. Using that "type" of character in a fantasy setting sounds interesting to me, really.

Stiger05 · Apr 27, 2012

Rufus Coppertop said:
Uh oh!

Yeah. I'm having a hard time right now because I just had knee surgery and have to wear a full leg brace on my right leg for 5 weeks. It's distressing in so many ways!

Raventongue · Apr 27, 2012

Rufus Coppertop said:
From what the little I know about Asperger's, it seems that in many cases it can be a blessing rather than a curse.

If part of your motive for the book is to promote neurodiversity (in literature or in general) and maybe create a better understanding of what it's like to live with Asperger's, I'd recommend trying to see it (and show it) as both.

Don't make your MC a hero despite his/her Asperger's, nor because of it. Make him or her a hero despite the difficulties Asperger's presents, and because of the blessings Asperger's comes with. For example, if you think of the readers you'd most want to send a message to in three groups:

1) Those who have Asperger's and see only the downsides.
2) Those who have Asperger's and the other people around them see only the upsides. They have difficulty getting other people to recognize the struggles that come with it.
3) Neurotypical folks who may not have put any thought into what it could be like to live with Asperger's before.

With a well-balanced, believable MC you can help group 1 to feel better about themselves and their strengths, give group 2 the solace of knowing they aren't the only ones who know what they're going through, and get group 3 to see Aspies as real people, with real problems and triumphs. All in one book!

Only you know what you struggle with and what you've gained; here's your chance to tell it like it is.

Rufus Coppertop · Apr 27, 2012

Raventongue said:
Don't make your MC a hero despite his/her Asperger's, nor because of it. Make him or her a hero despite the difficulties Asperger's presents, and because of the blessings Asperger's comes with.

Yeah, this.

Lineykins · Apr 27, 2012

Wow - I didn't know that the boy in "Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close" had autism. I thought his behavior was a combination of being very bright and consumed by grief.

Ryukami - I agree with the general consensus of this thread - I'd like more stories with characters like the one you describe. All the best.

auriel · Apr 28, 2012

Lineykins said:
Wow - I didn't know that the boy in "Extremely Loud and Incredibly Close" had autism. I thought his behavior was a combination of being very bright and consumed by grief.

Ryukami - I agree with the general consensus of this thread - I'd like more stories with characters like the one you describe. All the best.

It's not stated explicitly, but it definitely came across that way to me. In the movie version, he was definitely played as autistic. I have an autistic cousin of the same age as the character and they sounded eerily similar.

little_e · Apr 28, 2012

Bilbo Baggins is a hobbit, and people still love his story.

Cyia · Apr 28, 2012

little_e said:
Bilbo Baggins is a hobbit, and people still love his story.

Please tell me you didn't intend to compare an entire group of real people to a fictional creature with giant hairy feet as though the two have anything in common.

Please.

Rhoda Nightingale · Apr 29, 2012

I think this is a great idea. I've seen only a couple novels with characters who have synesthesia (like yours truly), one of which handled it beautifully and realistically, the other of which portrayed it as this hulking cloud of awfulness that made everyday life unbearable and awkward in her interactions with other people.

The key is research. Research, research, research. Clearly there are plenty of folks in this very forum with Asperger's to whom you can direct questions (if they're okay with answering them, that is), and I'd recommend having an aspie beta look over the full manuscript when you're finished.

It can and should be done. I feel like autism, and Asperger's in particular, are moving further into the public's awareness lately. Writing a YA novel with a central character who's dealing with it sounds like it could be terrific. Good luck!

Neurodiversity in YA?

Nogetsune

KateSmash

this was a triumph

Stiger05

auriel

Smish

Reads more than she writes.

lilysea

courtneyv

Sage

Our Lady of Parentheticals

Cyia

Rewriting My Destiny

thebloodfiend

Cory

missesdash

You can't sit with us!

Rufus Coppertop

Stiger05

Becca C.

Cyia

Rewriting My Destiny

Rufus Coppertop

GingerGunlock

paralibrarian

Stiger05

Raventongue

little orphan anarchist

Rufus Coppertop

Lineykins

auriel

little_e

Trust: that most precious coin.

Cyia

Rewriting My Destiny

Rhoda Nightingale

Vampire Junkie