Confused! Need help

I don't have any experience in this area, but I'm sure someone will be along shortly to offer advice. Good luck with your decision-making.

Honestly? It's not likely. Once the book is published, you've burned first rights, which is what most publishers want. You'll also have cost them e-rights, which are huge.

There's always a possibility that the sales will be so stellar that another press will want it, but still - Not Likely.

Kelliewallace, you might want to put a post over in the Bewares & Background Checks forum in this regard. There are several outstanding cintract experts here on AW who can help you. You can also send one of the Mods or even Mac a PM asking them to direct you to somebody with experience in contract areas.

Next scenario, and one I'd recommend anyway, is to contact an intellectual property lawyer and have them go over the stipulations with you carefully.

The major publishers all want the electronic rights too. You'll likely have a tough time selling paper-only rights once you've revealed first rights and e-rights are not available. (It's not impossible, but the odds are likely astronomical. Even John Locke who sold a million ebooks had to pay S&S to print and distribute paper books for him that he published as ebooks.)

That said, I wouldn't worry about it too much if you already took a shot with getting an agent/deal for it with the big publishers and this was the best offer that you got. Do the deal with the epublisher. POD a paper version yourself to piggyback on the digital release. Make sure your reversion rights are in your favor (timed contract, or minimum payment per period, etc) and get on with writing and selling your next book.

Kellie, may I ask, why do you feel the need for a publisher for your e-book? Many of us have self-published our own books on Amazon, Smashwords, etc. It's a little bit of work, but you retain total control, and more importantly, you make all of the profits. It's something to consider.

I think the use of an epublisher versus self publishing is a whole different discussion--this thread was about whether epublished books are likely to sell their print rights to another publisher. The answer is: very unlikely.

Honestly, if the book is already published then another publisher is unlikely to want it. Most print publishers will want electronic rights as well, after all, otherwise they would be competing with another publisher over the same book.

Think about what Nick said. Also, if you e-self-publish your book, if you want you can also bring it out in print when you're ready. Also, will this e-publisher give you more exposure than you can yourself? I don't believe another publishing house would only want the print version since they would be competing against each other for sales--the e-publisher and the print publisher.

FOTSGreg said:

Kelliewallace, you might want to put a post over in the Bewares & Background Checks forum in this regard. There are several outstanding cintract experts here on AW who can help you. You can also send one of the Mods or even Mac a PM asking them to direct you to somebody with experience in contract areas.

Next scenario, and one I'd recommend anyway, is to contact an intellectual property lawyer and have them go over the stipulations with you carefully.

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Greg, I'm sure you mean well: but I'm uncomfortable with the idea of AW's members handing out contract advice in this instance. It's fine for general advice but if there's a specific contract under consideration then Kelliewallace needs to find an agent, or a writers' organisation which provides such information under specific terms.

StoneWheller said:

Think about what Nick said. Also, if you e-self-publish your book, if you want you can also bring it out in print when you're ready. Also, will this e-publisher give you more exposure than you can yourself?

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StoneWheller, as has already been said, this is off-topic for this discussion.

I don't believe another publishing house would only want the print version since they would be competing against themselves.

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I don't understand your point. Could you explain?

OldHack, I apologize. I agree that handing out contract advice publically would be a bad idea. I was not clear. I meant that if the OP desired contract advice, that they could post a message regarding said request, and thus be placed in contact with several people here on AW who know such things in detail. I did not mean that contract terms or advice should be posted here nor anywhere else.

I did mean that I believe she needs advice from an intellectual property law attorney, however.

Kelliewallace, Just remember - anything worth doing is worth working hard for. If it was easy anybody could do it. Stick to it. You'll get there.

StoneWheller said:

I don't believe another publishing house would only want the print version since they would be competing against themselves.

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Should have been each other. Will edit that.

Kelliewallace, don't give up. Everyone knows that old 'no' from agents or publishers, but as long as you don't say no to writing, then there is always the possibility of a yes. Good luck with it.

kelliewallace said:

Thank you all for your advice. My main objective is to get it in print and so far its hard!

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This is the wrong kind of writing objective and will lead to nothing but frustration. Objectives need to be things within your control.

For example:

Querrying 10 agents within the next month is within your control and is a reasonable objective for a writer.

Getting an agent is not within your control and should not be an objective.

The average writer does not have success with their first story/novel/book. Some take 5 even 10 before finding something that clicks. The offer of an e-publisher (assuming the one that made the offer is reputable) is actually ahead of the game but it appears you are disatisfied with it for whatever reason.

Your focus should really should be on writing your next book (again, in your control), and then setting some reasonable goals for querries on the current book that don't interfere too much with writing.

Just 2 cents. Good luck regardless.

J. Tanner said:

This is the wrong kind of writing objective and will lead to nothing but frustration. Objectives need to be things within your control.

For example:

Querrying 10 agents within the next month is within your control and is a reasonable objective for a writer.

Getting an agent is not within your control and should not be an objective.

The average writer does not have success with their first story/novel/book. Some take 5 even 10 before finding something that clicks. The offer of an e-publisher (assuming the one that made the offer is reputable) is actually ahead of the game but it appears you are disatisfied with it for whatever reason.

Your focus should really should be on writing your next book (again, in your control), and then setting some reasonable goals for querries on the current book that don't interfere too much with writing.

Just 2 cents. Good luck regardless.

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I'm sorry, but IMO that's nonsense. Print publication is a totally reasonable goal, as is getting an agent. Both of those things are in fact largely within your control; yes, you may not manage to sell a book that's very well-written, but you're almost definitely not going to sell one that isn't, and writing quality is within your control. A goal or objective is something you work toward; aiming high is a good and smart thing to do.

If I'd never decided that my goal was to secure representation from a great agent and be published by a Big Six house, I never would have secured representation from a great agent and been published by a Big Six house.

There is nothing in the world wrong with having dreams and wanting to achieve something; by this standard, no one would ever succeed in anything--getting a job, getting married to the person they love, having children, buying a house, whatever else--because none of those things are totally within one person's control and are thus unreasonable objectives.

The fact that writing a publishable book takes a lot of work, and even that few of those who attempt to do so will succeed, is in no way an argument against trying. It certainly doesn't mean that the OP or anyone else should just give up and not work toward their dreams or set goals beyond "finish a book." Yes, it's important to be able to accept that you may not reach that goal, but that doesn't mean it's "wrong" to have it. What a depressing viewpoint.

The only people who never fail are those who don't try.

I'm not opposed to having the dreams. The objectives toward achieving those dreams need to be achievable goals within your control. Writing better, as you mentioned, is within your control and thus a good solid objective to work toward. "Getting published" is not, even if that's the hoped result of writing better. Getting published is a dream, not an objective.

Hope that clarifies my position on dreams vs objectives. (You can substitute other terms in for either and quibble about definitions but I don't think it's conceptually tough to understand the value in setting concrete achievable objectives within your control with the hope they result in making your dreams come true.)

J. Tanner said:

I'm not opposed to having the dreams. The objectives toward achieving those dreams need to be achievable goals within your control.

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For you they do. That's not necessarily so for others.

Writing better, as you mentioned, is within your control and thus a good solid objective to work toward. "Getting published" is not, even if that's the hoped result of writing better.

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I'm sorry, but I find it incredibly rude to tell someone that their objectives are "wrong." I don't think it's your place, or anyone else's place, to tell someone that they're "wrong" for having publication as an objective or that their objectives are no good.

And again, if we only set as objectives things entirely within our control people would achieve very little.

Getting published is a dream, not an objective.

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Not for those who set their mind to it, work hard, and achieve it.

Getting published was my objective. I'm glad it was, because if I hadn't made it my objective I wouldn't have submitted anywhere. I wouldn't have kept writing after my very first rejection.

Hope that clarifies my position on dreams vs objectives.

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Your position didn't need clarifying. You believe it's your place to tell others what sorts of goals are and are not correct for them, and you believe that unless it's something you can do all on your own entirely by your own steam and needing no one else at all you shouldn't consider it an objective. The post I quote now doesn't indicate your opinions on the subject are any different than they were in the first post.

(You can substitute other terms in for either and quibble about definitions but I don't think it's conceptually tough to understand the value in setting concrete achievable objectives within your control with the hope they result in making your dreams come true.)

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Who is quibbling about definitions? If anything, you're the one doing so by insisting on an extremely narrow--and, to my knowledge, totally original to you--definition of the word "objective."

I didn't say there was anything at all conceptually wrong with setting concrete achievable objectives within your control with the hope they result in your dreams coming true (and I'm certainly capable of understanding the concept, thank you). What I said was that "being published" is a perfectly acceptable objective, and that I take issue with telling others that their objectives are "wrong."

Seems like an overreaction to word choice but okay, I'm not interested in point by point argument. The OP should be able to understand both opinions and decide for herself (though I don't think we much disagree on anything tangible.)

Best.

As long as the objectives are concrete, and there is an objective criteria for measuring whether you've achieved that goal, then you're okay at the planning stage.

Examples:

1) Objective: Query ten different agents.

How will I know if I've achieved this goal?

I count ten different agents I have queried.

2) Objective: Get published in print by an advance and royalty paying publisher.

How will I know if I've achieved this goal?

I have been published in print by an advance and royalty paying publisher.

3) Win the war in Europe.

How will I know if I've achieved this goal?

Nazi Germany has signed a surrender document.

Poor examples:

1) Objective: Feel good about myself.

How will I know if I've achieved this goal?

???

2) Objective: Be a writer.

How will I know if I've achieved this goal?

???

3) Win the War on Drugs.

How will I know if I've achieved this goal?

???