What defines science fiction?

[Puddle Jumper]

It seems like horror and fantasy are being placed in the science fiction genre. I've always seen them as three seperate entities so I'm a bit confused. What exactly defines something as being science fiction?

[Axler]

I've always seen them as three seperate entities so I'm a bit confused. What exactly defines something as being science fiction?

The inclusion of science, mainly, actual or theoretical.

[HConn]

Science fiction is a story that wouldn't exist without its speculative science element.

[beezle]

The boundaries between the three are often blurred. Some sci fi has science that is more like magic than anything else, with no attempt at realism. I've read fantasy that make an attempt to root the fantastic origins of their worlds in long lost ancient science, and i've read more than a few horror novels that had strong science fiction themes.

[badducky]

Science Fiction is a fantasy. Albeit, one that uses "scientific" stuff as the basis for the fantasy. I.e. alternate history (i.e. Philip K. Dick), theoretical quandaries (i.e. Greg Bear), Philo-scientific dilemmas (i.e. Asimov), Technology as magical system (i.e. Gibson), Aliens as Magical beings instead of elves/dragons (i.e. McCaffrey), Modern philosophy given all of space to play in, instead of Faerieland (i.e. Heinlein), Modern Theology given all space to play in, instead of Faerieland (i.e. Herbert).

Basically, everything in the Sci-Fi/Fantasy/Horror section is actually just "Fantasy".

In fact, even "Literature" is a fantasy, sicne none of that stuff actually exists, either, but is merely a reflection and fantastical imaginary exploration of what we call "reality". Literature merely uses reality as it's magical system.

But, I'm a fantasy author, so take my words with a grain of salt.

Authors of crap will probably tell you that everything is their crap, and their crap is the best, right?

[Shwebb]

Orson Scott Card wrote a nonfiction book just about this issue and about techniques used in writing both.

He stated that fantasy uses some sort of magic or abilities that do not exist in our own world. Or something like that.

Anyhoo, it was a great book! (Whether you write in those genres or not.)

[Magus-21]

A panel of spec fic authors I attended some time ago (Turtledove was one of them) described the three genres of scifi, fantasy, and horror as:
Sci-Fi is about what might happen.
Fantasy is about what can't happen.
Horror is about what we don't want to happen.
I suspect they were trying to be clever for the largely layman audience, so take it with a grain of salt, but I thought they distilled the definitions down pretty reasonably.

[TMA-1]

I would say that science fiction deals with real and speculative science at least partly rooted in current science, and it would take a central position in the story.

[TMA-1]

Science fiction is a story that wouldn't exist without its speculative science element.
Very good point, I think.

[Ivonia]

I like the description used here:

http://www.watt-evans.com/sfvsfantasy.html

Yeah, sci-fi, fantasy, and lately, horror sometimes have very blurred lines on what defines them as such. Personally, I don't care too much, so long as the story is worth reading.

[Puddle Jumper]

A panel of spec fic authors I attended some time ago (Turtledove was one of them) described the three genres of scifi, fantasy, and horror as:

I suspect they were trying to be clever for the largely layman audience, so take it with a grain of salt, but I thought they distilled the definitions down pretty reasonably.
I really like that. :)

I really like fantasy the most but I don't agree with all fantasy being classified under science-fiction. For example, Lord of the Rings should not be defined under science fiction or the Chronicles of Narnia. I like science fiction but I think for it to be classified as such, there needs to be science involved. Many fantasy and most horror movies don't seem to have science in them - at least from what I've seen. Talking about movies, I could see Poltergeist being classified under sci-fi because they did try to figure things out through scientifc means in that story. House on the other hand had nothing scientific about it.

[Joseph The White]

My view on sci-fi is that it concerns itself with humans and there work toward the future. It tends to be existential, or at least not at all concerned with spiritual realities, and when they exist, science is employed to understand them and explain them. The concern for the "future," the onward movement of humanity is why sci-fi tends to be futuristic, explorative, etc.

Horror is kind of...I guess a sub genre. Horror can really fit in any category. It's just when those sci-fi, or even fantasy, ideas you have become, well, horrifying. Any genre can have a horror side to it, although Fantasy and sci-fi more than others because of those genre's fantastic natures.

- Joe

[loquax]

Ummm Puddle Jumper.... nobody's saying fantasy is a subgenre of science fiction. It's the other way round.

[TMA-1]

Science fiction is a subgenre of fantasy? What kind of SF do you read?

[loquax]

Science fiction is a subgenre of fantasy? What kind of SF do you read? I'll refer you to badducky's post.

[Jamesaritchie]

Definitions can vary widely, but in reality, publishers and movie makers really decide what is and isn't science fiction, based on any criteria they choose.

[Axler]

Definitions can vary widely, but in reality, publishers and movie makers really decide what is and isn't science fiction, based on any criteria they choose.

They may choose to interpret s.f./fantasy in their own way for marketing purposes, but the distinction between the two categories is fairly clear-cut and each have their own rules.

You can't write a mystery novel without the mystery and you can't write a science-fiction novel without the science, regardless of what somebody arbitrarily chooses to call it...sticking a feather in a cap and calling macaroni doesn't make it so.

[Jamesaritchie]

They may choose to interpret s.f./fantasy in their own way for marketing purposes, but the distinction between the two categories is fairly clear-cut and each have their own rules.

You can't write a mystery novel without the mystery and you can't write a science-fiction novel without the science, regardless of what somebody arbitrarily chooses to call it...sticking a feather in a cap and calling macaroni doesn't make it so.

No, but you can certainly write science fiction using bad science (FTL drive, dogfights in space, etc.) This isn't science at all. It's fantasy disguised as SF. And you can certainly mix in all sorts of elements from fantasy and horror. Where movies are concerned, most science fiction seems to be pure horror with a spaceship thrown in. A good many novels are this way, as well.

And where actually getting published is concerned, sticking a feather in a cap and calling it macaroni is very much a part of the business.

Hard SF, using only science that's possible, and that isn't full of fantasy and horror as a plotline, may have its own, specific rules, but this kind of hard SF is only a small part of science fiction writing and movie making.

[Axler]

Hard SF, using only science that's possible, and that isn't full of fantasy and horror as a plotline, may have its own, specific rules, but this kind of hard SF is only a small part of science fiction writing and movie making.

Theoretical science is the science in science-fiction.

[Silver-Midnight]

So, I have a question. If a character has telepathic or telekinetic abilities, would that be Fantasy or Science Fiction?

[amergina]

So, I have a question. If a character has telepathic or telekinetic abilities, would that be Fantasy or Science Fiction?

I think that would depend on the rest of the story and the world setting.

You can have characters with telepathic and telekinetic abilities in a fantasy and you can have them in science fiction. It's just that in the former, the abilities are viewed as magical and in the latter, the abilities are viewed as genetic.

That is, Merlin reading your mind or moving objects about in Camelot is seen as fantasy, while Professor X reading your mind or moving objects in modern-day New England is seen as science fiction.

[Smiling Ted]

Roger Zelazny had a great quote on the difference between science fiction and fantasy in Lord of Light. Actually, it wasn't directly on literary genre, but it was so apt...well, it's one of the reasons that I love the guy. Here it is:

"Ah, but it makes a great deal of difference, you see. It is the difference between the unknown and the unknowable, between science and fantasy. It is a matter of essence. The four points of the compass be knowledge, logic, wisdom...and the unknown. Some do bow in that final direction. Others advance upon it. To bow before the one is to lose sight of the three. I may submit to the unknown, but never to the unknowable."

In short, fantasy assumes a force (magic) that in the final analysis, can never be ultimately explained and experimented with. It's unknowable. Science fiction deals only with the unknown. And the best science fiction asks "What if?" The answers to "What If?" can be very unsettling. Fantasy doesn't ask, and is often more comforting...

[Silver-Midnight]

I think that would depend on the rest of the story and the world setting.

You can have characters with telepathic and telekinetic abilities in a fantasy and you can have them in science fiction. It's just that in the former, the abilities are viewed as magical and in the latter, the abilities are viewed as genetic.

That is, Merlin reading your mind or moving objects about in Camelot is seen as fantasy, while Professor X reading your mind or moving objects in modern-day New England is seen as science fiction.


Okay, I think I have a better idea of now. So, even if the story was say 75%+ fantasy, if a person had a genetic ability, like telekinesis or telepathy, then that makes it have at least some scientific elements or Scientific Fantasy.

[dempsey]

Okay, I think I have a better idea of now. So, even if the story was say 75%+ fantasy, if a person had a genetic ability, like telekinesis or telepathy, then that makes it have at least some scientific elements or Scientific Fantasy.

No, it'd probably still be fantasy. Where in sci-fi they say "genetic" in fantasy they say "passed down through the generations."

[amergina]

Okay, I think I have a better idea of now. So, even if the story was say 75%+ fantasy, if a person had a genetic ability, like telekinesis or telepathy, then that makes it have at least some scientific elements or Scientific Fantasy.

Maybe. It would depend on the rest of the novel. Is it an ability passed down through generations that those in the novel see as a gift of the gods, but you the author know is genetic? Maybe fantasy.

Is it a novel of a society on the brink of their own Age of Enlightenment where things they once thought of as magic aren't and they're learning the "gifts from the gods" are just genetic happenstance? Maybe science fantasy.

There a certain point when these sorts of discussions come down to splitting hairs. Some books live in that hazy liminal zone between genres or subgenres and it's hard to play pin-the-genre with them.

[Silver-Midnight]

Maybe. It would depend on the rest of the novel. Is it an ability passed down through generations that those in the novel see as a gift of the gods, but you the author know is genetic? Maybe fantasy.

Is it a novel of a society on the brink of their own Age of Enlightenment where things they once thought of as magic aren't and they're learning the "gifts from the gods" are just genetic happenstance? Maybe science fantasy.

There a certain point when these sorts of discussions come down to splitting hairs. Some books live in that hazy liminal zone between genres or subgenres and it's hard to play pin-the-genre with them.

I mean the characters themselves would know it's genetic I suppose. Thank you. Again, sorry for the barrage of questions, I was just trying to clear a few things up I guess.

[Buffysquirrel]

If people are including Horror and Fantasy, it's probably because they're talking about Speculative Fiction, which has the same initials and causes a great deal of confusion.