Does this sentence need a comma?

Plot Device · Feb 6, 2011

A mob boss named Murphy is in his office with his thugs all around. He is somewhat pissed off because he now has to deal with someone in his district who is getting uppity. He is about to give some orders to his men. (I inserted the name "Murphy" in a set of brackets in the below excerpt just to give you guys some context.)

He [Murphy] scribbled on a paper, folded it and handed it to Gavin. After issuing orders and taking control Murphy’s charm revived.

Should there be a comma after the word "control"??

I'm proofreading someone else's novel.

And I do not own any of the "style" manuals. Would I have gotten the correct answer in A Manual of Style? What other books should I keep on hand for these nitpicky questions?

night-flyer · Feb 6, 2011

When I read the sentence my thought was that there should be a comma after control. But I'm wrong a lot. So you might want to wait and see what others say. :Shrug:

Ken · Feb 6, 2011

... I think so too. There's a part that's left out, namely what he's in control of. A comma is warranted for that though not required. The sentence is also easier to read with the comma. Not sure if that warrants usage, alone?

czjaba · Feb 6, 2011

I would say it needs a comma, too.

Plot Device · Feb 6, 2011

I'm gonna go with the comma then.

Terie · Feb 6, 2011

It needs a comma after 'control' because that part of the sentence is a dependent clause, and an introductory dependent clause typically takes a comma.

I say 'typically' because that 'rule' is evolving, and if an introductory dependent clause is short, the comma can be omitted. Also, it's omitted more often in the UK than in the US.

I would suggest that you get your hands on a basic grammar book such as is used for teaching jr high/high school students, or even basic comp to undergrads. Pop up to your nearest community college or university book shop and take a look at the grammar books they sell for basic comp classes. (That way, if you're lucky, you'll find used ones that cost less.) Look through them and choose the one that you connect with the best.

You can worry about style guides, such as Chicago, later. Those are written assuming you already have mastered the basics of grammar and can be confusing if you haven't yet.

tanglewoodtracey · Feb 6, 2011

I agree that there should be a comma. I "hear" the pause.

Hope this helps.

Tracey

Lil · Feb 6, 2011

Yes.
The introductory phrase is too long to leave it out. Plus someone reading quickly might start reading it as "[to] control Murphy."

Marlys · Feb 6, 2011

It would need the comma, but there's another problem with the sentence: the introductory clause modifies 'charm,' not 'Murphy.' Murphy's charm didn't issue orders, Murphy did.

One possible rewrite: Now that he had issued orders and taken control, Murphy's charm revived.

Plot Device · Feb 6, 2011

Marlys said:
It would need the comma, but there's another problem with the sentence: the introductory clause modifies 'charm,' not 'Murphy.' Murphy's charm didn't issue orders, Murphy did.

One possible rewrite: Now that he had issued orders and taken control, Murphy's charm revived.

I was give explicit orders NOT to rewrite anything. The well-educated gentleman who wrote this very-well researched historical novel has more letters after his name than I could ever hope to earn in my entire lifetime. So only spelling, typos, and the occasionally omitted bit of punctuation is all I'm allowed to correct.

Marlys · Feb 6, 2011

Plot Device said:
I was give explicit orders NOT to rewrite anything. The well-educated gentleman who wrote this very-well researched historical novel more letters after his name than I could ever hope to earn in my entire lifetime. So only spelling, typos, and the occasionally omitted bit of punctuation is all I'm allowed to correct.

I'd at least point it out to him and let him fix it on his own, then. It's a grammatical error, and would be embarrassing for him if it made it into print.

Jamesaritchie · Feb 6, 2011

He needs to return some of those letters after his name. He's wasting them.

rainsmom · Feb 6, 2011

What JAR said.

absitinvidia · Feb 6, 2011

Plot Device said:
I was give explicit orders NOT to rewrite anything. The well-educated gentleman who wrote this very-well researched historical novel has more letters after his name than I could ever hope to earn in my entire lifetime. So only spelling, typos, and the occasionally omitted bit of punctuation is all I'm allowed to correct.

But you have to leave incorrect grammar intact? Yikes.

Plot Device · Feb 6, 2011

The book was already published once about ten years ago by Diamond Rock Publishing. This is now the Second Edition. So the added portions need a good solid proofread. I have no idea what's new and what's old. I am reading the whole 120,000 words right now.

There was also the odd complication of the newest draft of this Second Editon getting transferred from one document format into another, and (as it was explained to me by the guy who contracted me) the back third of the book is now riddled with funkified punctuation of the sort that sometimes happens when you and I do a copy-paste from one web site into another.

He's guilty of chronic passive voice, and individual sentences with way too many clauses bult upon clauses builted up clauses, which might strike some as poetic.

I am also findng an odd switching back and forth between present tense and past tense at times.

BTW--what do you guys think of $300.00 for 120K words?

Susan Coffin · Feb 6, 2011

I would take a sticky, make the note of the incorrect modification, and put it next to the sentence. That way, you know you've went beyond the call of duty without manually correcting it. He can make the decision. I would also make notes of whatever else find that I am not allowed to correct.

Yes, I think $300 is way to cheap for 120,000. I was reading in the 2010 Writer's Market that content editing, copy editing, manuscript critique are generally priced between $40 and $100 an hour. Content editing and copy editing did not have project prices, but manuscript critique average was $500.

I've never provided these services, so I am just going by what I read.

Bufty · Feb 6, 2011

Fifty cents a page? Cripes.

Does this sentence need a comma?

Plot Device

A woman said to write like a man.

night-flyer

roasting cows

Ken

czjaba

dreaming of the day...

Plot Device

A woman said to write like a man.

Terie

Writer is as Writer does

tanglewoodtracey

Loves a good trainwreck

Lil

Marlys

Resist. Love. Go outside.

Plot Device

A woman said to write like a man.

Marlys

Resist. Love. Go outside.

Jamesaritchie

rainsmom

Feeling like an old timer

absitinvidia

A bit of a wallflower

Plot Device

A woman said to write like a man.

Susan Coffin

Tell it like it Is

Bufty

Where have the last ten years gone?