Book Covers Showing Too Much

[Steve 211]

I recently read Gary Paulsen's The River (warning - plot details to be given away here), and while it was a good YA read, the middle section completely bottomed out for me because of the cover (http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0440407532/ref=sib_dp_pt/002-6436960-6359255#reader-link).

The boy's out camping in the wilds with an instructor, who gets hit by lightning and goes into a coma.

The radio did not work and Brian could not call for help.
So, then what?
But you know, from the cover (and even from the title), exactly what he's going to do. So you get impatient with the kid sitting around for twelve pages - looking at a map, thinking of how to get the guy out, and finally getting the idea.

How could he?
The river. If he had a boat . . . or a raft.
Book covers have to entice readers with promises of action and adventure, but are there books you've read that gave away too much on the cover? And how do publishers actually decide how much can be given away?

[aruna]

But you know, from the cover (and even from the title), exactly what he's going to do. So you get impatient with the kid sitting around for twelve pages - looking at a map, thinking of how to get the guy out, and finally getting the idea.
?

I agree! whoever came up with that cover should be tarred and feathered! Can't think of any similar cases right now.

[Garpy]

Is this a recent publication? Because the cover image looks very dated....sort of like an old Willard Price 'Adventure' novel.

[Steve 211]

The book came out in '91, but yeah, it does seem like those old ones.

Paulsen's first book in the Brian series was Hatchet (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0689826990/002-6436960-6359255?v=glance&n=283155&s=books&v=glance). The cover works very well - shows a boy, a hatchet, and a wolf. You get the setting and the theme - a survival book. But no plot giveaways.

Another in the series, Brian's Winter (http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0440227194/002-6436960-6359255?v=glance&n=283155&s=books&v=glance), also gives a good thematic summary in its cover.

The only other novel I have that seems to give away an important plot point is this one by Lynn Flewelling (http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0553577255/ref=sib_dp_pt/002-6436960-6359255#reader-link). Fantasy novels do need to show more - a glimpse into their world. But even with this one, I didn't know whose funeral pyre it was - just that something ominous was in the works.

[Jamesaritchie]

I recently read Gary Paulsen's The River (warning - plot details to be given away here), and while it was a good YA read, the middle section completely bottomed out for me because of the cover (http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0440407532/ref=sib_dp_pt/002-6436960-6359255#reader-link).

The boy's out camping in the wilds with an instructor, who gets hit by lightning and goes into a coma.


But you know, from the cover (and even from the title), exactly what he's going to do. So you get impatient with the kid sitting around for twelve pages - looking at a map, thinking of how to get the guy out, and finally getting the idea.


Book covers have to entice readers with promises of action and adventure, but are there books you've read that gave away too much on the cover? And how do publishers actually decide how much can be given away?


I loved that book. I guess I'd say I knew what he was going to do, even without the cover. It was how he did it, how well it worked, the problems he had with it that mattered. Very good cover, in my opinion. For me, it did just what a cover is supposed to do.
What bothers me is when a cover has a scene like this and it never shows up in the book.

[Saanen]

I'd think the title would give away the same information. But I haven't read the book yet so I don't know whether the river has importance earlier in the book.

[henriette]

what ever happened to books with simply the title and the author's name embossed on the cover? so many books have such horribly distracting artwork that often does not do the book in question justice. for me, it defeats the purpose of using my own imagination (especially if i were reading a fantasy novel).

my favourite covers are either portraits of people or a plain title. i take all dustjackets off my hard cover books because they look so much prettier on the bookshelf with their dark spines and metallic fonts. dustjackets are evil.

[Aconite]

what ever happened to books with simply the title and the author's name embossed on the cover?
Marketing. From such a cover, you can't tell anything about the book at first glance (especially if it doesn't have cover copy). You don't even know if it's the kind of book you want to spend time leafing through to see if you'd like it. You can't tell if it's a gritty Western, elegant literary fiction, urban fantasy, or a cozy mystery.

As for book descriptions that tell too much: The editor of Kafka's Metamorphosis gave away the Big Reveal right on the cover.

Added: Oh, wait. Crap. I think that happened in the introduction to the story.

Spoiler alert

Margarat Frazer spent half of The Reeve's Tale setting up a supposed plague epidemic, only to have the cover-copy writer reveal on the jacket that it turns out to be measles. She was not happy.

[henriette]

aconite- excellent point. i guess i'm old fashioned, and am one of those who hate advertising in bathrooms and taxi cabs and the onslaught of "buy this!" in our culture today. cheesy bookcovers are an extension of this modern philosophy, i guess.

this brings up an issue for my own novel. i have very specific ideas for the artwork and cover. my novel is historical fiction set in 1835, so it is incredibly important to me that my book will have an old-fashioned cover with a pen and ink portrait of my heroine and not some windblown woman in a corset with fabio standing behind her. i feel such a cheesy cover would scare away my target audience.

how much control do authors have over artwork? would it be beneficial to include cover artwork when submitting to publishers, or would it work against me?

[Jamesaritchie]

how much control do authors have over artwork? would it be beneficial to include cover artwork when submitting to publishers, or would it work against me?

Very little to no control, though you may be able to offer your opinion. Submitting art work isn't going to help at a publisher of any real size. They have a marketing department, and pay huge money to learn what sort of cover sells.

Worry about the writing and let marketing worry about the cover. Offer an opinion, but realize that your job isn't the cover, it's what's between the covers.

[Aconite]

i guess i'm old fashioned, and am one of those who hate advertising in bathrooms and taxi cabs and the onslaught of "buy this!" in our culture today.
I stopped going to movies in theaters when they started showing commercials--not trailers--before the movies. I object to paying to be advertised to as a captive audience member. (Note to others who hate this: If you manage to score tickets to advance screenings, they usually don't have commercials.)

how much control do authors have over artwork?
Very little. You can make your preferences known to your editor, who may take them into account, but your cover will be largely a marketing decision.

would it be beneficial to include cover artwork when submitting to publishers, or would it work against me?
Don't do this. It screams "amateur."

[henriette]

thank you for all the great advice. i do want to point out that the portrait i had in mind would be professionally done by an excellent portrait artist whose work i am in awe in.

i find it a little disconcerting that an author having a total vision of their book would be considered amateur. coming from a background in music, it seems strange to me that the artist would not be involved in the packaging of their work. for example, it would not be seen as an amateurish move for a musician to have specific ideas for their album art. or for an actor to have an idea of how they want to look in the headshots. in fact, it almost borders on professional neglect not to consider such things.

book covers are so uninspiring these days, it shocks me that an author with a fresh idea (or at least one that stands out from the rest) would be looked down upon. but, if that is the reality of the business, it's a good thing to know. thanks again :)

[Aconite]

thank you for all the great advice. i do want to point out that the portrait i had in mind would be professionally done by an excellent portrait artist whose work i am in awe in.
If and when your book is sold, you can recommend the artist you have in mind to your editor. Including the cover art with the manuscript submission is a bad idea.

for example, it would not be seen as an amateurish move for a musician to have specific ideas for their album art.
Of course you can have ideas. No one said otherwise. But you don't send artwork with your submission--that's the amateurish part.

book covers are so uninspiring these days, it shocks me that an author with a fresh idea (or at least one that stands out from the rest) would be looked down upon.
An author who submitted cover art with a manuscript would be looked down upon, not one who had an original idea. But bear in mind that what you think is "original and fresh" may very well be stale. The kind of cover you're talking about, for example, was fashionable in the 1990s for certain kinds of books. It could seem dated now, or it might suggest a subgenre other than the one appropriate for your book.

It's a good idea to understand the why's and how's of something in a business before you decide it's dumb.

[Jamesaritchie]

thank you for all the great advice. i do want to point out that the portrait i had in mind would be professionally done by an excellent portrait artist whose work i am in awe in.

i find it a little disconcerting that an author having a total vision of their book would be considered amateur. coming from a background in music, it seems strange to me that the artist would not be involved in the packaging of their work. for example, it would not be seen as an amateurish move for a musician to have specific ideas for their album art. or for an actor to have an idea of how they want to look in the headshots. in fact, it almost borders on professional neglect not to consider such things.

book covers are so uninspiring these days, it shocks me that an author with a fresh idea (or at least one that stands out from the rest) would be looked down upon. but, if that is the reality of the business, it's a good thing to know. thanks again :)

You can have ideas, and you can offer them. But your idea of what looks good, and the public's idea of what they want, are likely to be very different things. It isn't about quality. The best professional artist in the world may still produce a cover that doesn't sell.

Professionalism means letting each professional do his or her job, not in trying to do it for them. Publishers spend a lot of money, exert time and energy, on research to determine what the public buys and what it doesn't. Sometimes they get it wrong, but more often than not, they get it right.

In truth, a cover that simply catches the eye from a distance through color or design can be far better for a book than a beautiful cover that doesn't.

You can always offer ideas, and if the marketing department likes them, they may go with one. Just don't count on it, and don't even think about it until someone makes an offer for your novel.

And from my experience, most musicians and actors pose when, where, and how they're told to pose. It's the professional photographer who decides which pose looks good and which sucks.

[henriette]

james- thank you for your kind and thoughtful post. it is true that actors and musicians are told where to pose etc., but at the same time their actual image and how they want to portray themselves to the public is often their choice (or it was before MTV). when the artist loses control, they seem to rebel (case in point george michael, who refused to be in his "freedom" video and eventually got into a huge fight with the record label, ending in lawsuits). it's interesting to me to compare the arts and learn the differences behind the scenes, and to ask published writers about their own feelings about creative control.

and hey, i'd never want to be seen as stepping on any professional toes. if a publisher decides publish my book and put fabio on my cover, i guess there's not much i can do about it besides grit my teeth and smile through disappointed tears. :)

"It's a good idea to understand the why's and how's of something in a business before you decide it's dumb."

wow aconite, i never came to any conclusions that anything was "dumb". but now i do feel a little stupid.

[Aconite]

wow aconite, i never came to any conclusions that anything was "dumb". but now i do feel a little stupid.
Sorry, henriette. I thought that was implied in, "book covers are so uninspiring these days, it shocks me that an author with a fresh idea (or at least one that stands out from the rest) would be looked down upon. but, if that is the reality of the business, it's a good thing to know." If I was wrong about that, I apologize. It wasn't my intention to make you feel stupid.

[Aconite]

when the artist loses control, they seem to rebel (case in point george michael, who refused to be in his "freedom" video and eventually got into a huge fight with the record label, ending in lawsuits).
The fact that this was newsworthy tells you that it's unusual. Unless you're intimately familiar with the music business from the inside, you really can't determine what *actually* goes on in the business, as opposed to what you seem to see from the outside.

[henriette]

aconite- nice. i've been around the music business my entire life (the only job my father has ever had is as a musician), worked on and off as a musician for the past decade and have many friends in bands who are slogging through the business. i've produced a cd and toured with a working band. my college education is in music theatre, another world where the struggle between "what kind of artist am i" and "what kind of artist do they want me to be?" is a big issue. what connects them all, from music theatre actors to rock bands is the constant issue of creative control. in my brain, the cover of a book is a reflection of the author like john and yoko's "two virgins" cover is a reflection of their own philosophy and of the music.

there are hundreds of examples of artists vs. corporations on the touchy subject of creative control. i used george michael as an extreme example to make my point, as everyone is aware of the brouhaha he's been through. marvin gaye went through similar problems with his classic album "what's going on"- his refusal to change any of it caused motown to shelve it for almost 2 years. etc etc. moving that discussion into the art of novel writing was my intention, as was learning a bit more about the business.

i think this is my last response in this thread as i would rather hold discussions with people who don't discredit my opinions, knowledge or background. flame wars don't interest me. lesson learned. *fin*

[Saanen]

Well, this is a very interesting and informative thread to me and I don't see any attempt to start a flame war. I hope you change your mind and continue the discussion. Sometimes it's hard to get the proper tone across in an online forum(even though we're writers--there's just something about the medium), and unfortunately innocent statements can be misinterpreted too easily.

Anyway, my own two cents: I think the industry surrounding any of the arts (literature, music, film, etc.) is a double-edged sword. That is, it does its job getting the very best work packaged and marketed so that people can enjoy it, but on the other hand it also tends to distrust the creativity that sparks the best work. I have no first-hand knowledge of the music business, but from what I've read and been told by musician friends, it has much more of a stranglehold on artistic license and creative control than the writing business does.

[Aconite]

i think this is my last response in this thread as i would rather hold discussions with people who don't discredit my opinions, knowledge or background. flame wars don't interest me. lesson learned. *fin*
Where did I or anyone else discredit you, your knowledge, background, or opinions? Nowhere until your last post did you indicate you had experience in any of the fields you discussed, yet we were supposed to somehow know you were an expert and give your words the weight they deserve?

If you think this was a flame war, or even the start of one, you hang out on some *very* mild-mannered boards. :)

[NicoleJLeBoeuf]

I stopped going to movies in theaters when they started showing commercials--not trailers--before the movies. I object to paying to be advertised to as a captive audience member. (Note to others who hate this: If you manage to score tickets to advance screenings, they usually don't have commercials.)Do you have a Landmark Theater in your area?

www.landmarktheater.com

They seem to be a chain which acquires quirky local theaters and lets them retain their quirks. They also tend to show indie movies and limited release features. My husband and I just saw Mirrormask at the Landmark Esquire in Denver (and we're fond of the Landmark Crossings in Boulder), and there wasn't a single advertisement. Only movie previews. Previews for movies that looked darn good, in fact.

Plus, the stuff they sell at their concession stands tends to be more interesting than the usual movie fare. Mighty Leaf tea bags, locally produced snacks, refills on fountain drinks and popcorn, good happy things.

But, anyway. No commercials at the Landmark Esquire, and none of that crappy "countdown to the feature" stuff the AMC likes to do. Until the movie starts, just previews, and until the previews start, just radio-ish music.

[Jamesaritchie]

I tend to like commercials before movies for the same reason I like them on TV. . .that's when I go do other things.

As for creative control, this is more often fought over content, not periphery. Writers, actors, and singers all have times when they are willing to fight over the content of a book, a movie, or an album, but I've never known an actor to fight over a movie poster, darned few musicians who were willing to fight over an album cover, and very few writers who were willing to go to the wall over a book cover.

It's always good to have input, to be able to voice your ideas, but save the battles for the content. You may well have times when fighting over content is essential.

[aruna]

I loved that book. I guess I'd say I knew what he was going to do, even without the cover. It was how he did it, how well it worked, the problems he had with it that mattered. Very good cover, in my opinion. For me, it did just what a cover is supposed to do.
What bothers me is when a cover has a scene like this and it never shows up in the book.

But for somebody who hasn't read the book, the cover is definitely a spoiler.

When my pub. was trying to conceive of a cover for my third book, my idea was a woman in a sari staning in water in front of a temple. My editor liked the idea very much, but what they finally came up with for the hardback was very far from that - it was the face of a ragged Indian girl, and the silhouette of a temple in the background; I didn't like it. The face looked too depressive.
http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/000712385X.02._PE30_SCMZZZZZZZ_.jpg (http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/000712385X.02.LZZZZZZZ.jpg)

But when the paperback came out - hey presto! Exactly what I had suggested. A pleasant surprise. (Apart fromnthe fact that the Taj Mahal is a Muslim building, and the woman is Hindu!)
http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/0007123868.02.TZZZZZZZ.jpg (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/am/026-8113891-7436424?p=ASIN%2F0007123868%2Fref%3Dpd%5Fcpt%5Fgw% 5Fi%2F&l=4284003&c=4284003&i=2336242501&s=1)

[Jamesaritchie]

But for somebody who hasn't read the book, the cover is definitely a spoiler.

When my pub. was trying to conceive of a cover for my third book, my idea was a woman in a sari staning in water in front of a temple. My editor liked the idea very much, but what they finally came up with for the hardback was very far from that - it was the face of a ragged Indian girl, and the silhouette of a temple in the background; I didn't like it. The face looked too depressive.
http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/000712385X.02._PE30_SCMZZZZZZZ_.jpg (http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/000712385X.02.LZZZZZZZ.jpg)

But when the paperback came out - hey presto! Exactly what I had suggested. A pleasant surprise. (Apart fromnthe fact that the Taj Mahal is a Muslim building, and the woman is Hindu!)
http://images-eu.amazon.com/images/P/0007123868.02.TZZZZZZZ.jpg (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/am/026-8113891-7436424?p=ASIN%2F0007123868%2Fref%3Dpd%5Fcpt%5Fgw% 5Fi%2F&l=4284003&c=4284003&i=2336242501&s=1)



I can only say the cover spoiled nothing for me. If something as simple as a photo on the cover was a spolier, I wouldn't have read 90% of the novels I've picked up. I strongly suspect that cover drew in a heck of a lot more readers than it frightened away.

[aruna]

I can only say the cover spoiled nothing for me. If something as simple as a photo on the cover was a spolier, I wouldn't have read 90% of the novels I've picked up. I strongly suspect that cover drew in a heck of a lot more readers than it frightened away.

Well, as I said, I haven't read the book, but from the description the poster gave, I gather that "rafting someone to safety" was the solution to a story problem.. I wouldn't say the 90% of the books, or even 10% of the books I've read give away the solution to a story problem! In fact, I can't think of a single book who's cover does gives away a problem solution. Nope; i really can't.

[Jamesaritchie]

Well, as I said, I haven't read the book, but from the description the poster gave, I gather that "rafting someone to safety" was the solution to a story problem.. I wouldn't say the 90% of the books, or even 10% of the books I've read give away the solution to a story problem! In fact, I can't think of a single book who's cover does gives away a problem solution. Nope; i really can't.

I've seen more than a few, but none have ever spoiled a book for me. They only make me want to read it more. Of course, I may read a good book seven or eight or twelve times, and even after this I still enjoy reading it again. And The River isn't as simple as what's on the cover.

Just about the only thing that bothers me with covers is the reverse. I can't tell you how many novels I've read with great action scenes on the cover that never show up at all in the book. If it's on the cover, I want it in the book.

[Steve 211]

Wow - lots of stuff here.

Thanks, Aruna, for backing me up and the insight into your own publishing experiences. Beautiful paperback cover.

James - I guess what got me most is that knowing what's on the cover makes you really get impatient with Brian as he struggles to come up with a way to save Derek. It's a major plot point, and yet we know what it will be, so there's so dramatic tension, just a long wait until he finally gets it. The story does take off after that, though.

About plain book covers, yeah, I take off dust jackets as well. And it is sad how in-your-face flash-flash-color-flash advertising is today. The other day I saw photos of Juicy Fruit gum through the ages - in the 40's all you needed was a label. By the 70's it was a simple green package. Now I wouldn't even recognize it - it's bubbly purple rainbow yuck. And Corn Flakes used to show corn on the box. Now it's Dark Vader in a light saber duel.

And henrietta - no one intentionally put you down. You just sounded a little naive mentioning George Michael, even though (unknownst to us) you mentioned him only so that we'd all understand what you meant. I know what it's like to read demeaning comments into everything someone says in reply to your comments, but the good side of it is that it makes us better writers 'cause we're so good at imagining worst-case scenarios.

[henriette]

when it comes to the writing business, yes, i am terribly, disgustingly naive. i admit that freely. the reason i come here is to get help and inspiration from the wise sages that are usually incredibly kind and helpful.

we all come from different backgrounds, have different strengths and opinions. if someone tells me their opinion about what happens in the sports biz, for example, i will assume they *know* what they are talking about and not challenge their intelligence. it just seems rude to imply otherwise without politely asking for their qualifications to be sure of the validity of their statements.

aconite's comments (it's only aconite i have issue with) really burned me up because she/he/it discredited my opinions before inquiring if i am somewhat qualified to make such statements. i take it for granted that anyone who takes the time to post an opinion here is an intelligent and thoughtful human being. so i was angered by these quotes:

"It's a good idea to understand the why's and how's of something in a business before you decide it's dumb."

(never did i say anything to do with the writing biz was dumb- in fact i expressed my gratitude for being set straight by james and even aconite.)

and

"Unless you're intimately familiar with the music business from the inside, you really can't determine what *actually* goes on in the business, as opposed to what you seem to see from the outside."

(perhaps inquiring about someone's background would be a better response than implying that i don't really know what i'm talking about. is it imperative for us all to list our life qualifications before we relate a story or express an opinion in order to be taken seriously?)

anyway, just wanted to set the record straight. truly i am not that overly sensitive, but those two posts in a row kind of hurt my feelings. however, i thank steve, saanen and james for their continued encouragement.

[Aconite]

henriette, I'm sorry you decided to take my statements the way you did. It wasn't my intention to hurt your feelings; nor was it my intention to insult you. I've already explained myself, so I won't go through it again. Suffice it to say that different people have different communication styles, and judging what someone else meant by what you would have meant if you'd done the same thing often leads to misunderstandings.

[Aconite]

Do you have a Landmark Theater in your area?

Unfortunately, no. But I'll be watching for one now. Thank you!

[fallenangelwriter]

Henriette- I know a number of books with covers which, for one reason or another, i detest, but to dismiss modern cover art as a whole seems uncalled for. I have a number of fairly new books with art that is both reasonably pretty and reasonably representative of the book.

the worst cover, IMHO, is one that doesn't sell the book. after that comes covers which are horribly inconsistent (a character doesn't look right, it depicts a scene which could never have happened, or someone's hair is the wrong color). those bother me, but you can't tell they're inconsistent until you've read the book.

third would be a cover which misleads the reader into expecting a different kind of book. by this i mean broad strokes- i have read plenty of books with covers that prominently feature a dragon which is in fatc a minor plot point, but i expected epic fantasy and that's what i got.

beyond, that, i wouldn't really worry. sure, it might not be my personal favorite style, but the cover is for readers, not me- and if it represents something about the book while selling it to fans of the genre, that's good enough for me.

[Aconite]

after that comes covers which are horribly inconsistent (a character doesn't look right, it depicts a scene which could never have happened
My favorite example of this was the book whose cover showed a gentleman assisting a lady down from a carriage by holding both her hands in his. Since the fact that he'd lost an arm in a war figured heavily in the book....

Poor, poor, poor author. Luckily, this kind of thing is rare.

[Jamesaritchie]

My favorite example of this was the book whose cover showed a gentleman assisting a lady down from a carriage by holding both her hands in his. Since the fact that he'd lost an arm in a war figured heavily in the book....

Poor, poor, poor author. Luckily, this kind of thing is rare.

Not rare enough. Unfortunately, cover artists are not required to read the book in question, and quite often do the cover art simply from the jacket copy, or even from the genre.

[Lyra Jean]

Is that why when I read a book, "Fever" can't remember the author.

On the cover was a blonde who got cancer. She lost all her hair, chemo does that. Anyway in the story her hair is black. When she gets better she got a brown wig because she wanted to be like her stepmom but then switched to a black wig so kids at school wouldn't ask why her hair changed color after her original hair grew back.

Why do girls always have to be blonde on the cover?

[Aconite]

On the cover was a blonde who got cancer.
rosemerry, I'm dying to know how how they showed on the cover that the blonde had cancer. The possibilities I'm imagining don't bear thinking about.