YA science fiction

[Garpy]

I'm sort of doing a bit of research. It strikes me that there's a lot of YA fantasy out there....lots of damned dragons, and wizards, but not much in the way of science fiction. Does anyone know of any good YA Scifi? Does anyone have any ideas why there isn't much YA scifi out there?

I would have thought that young hungry readers would by now have begun to tire a bit of spells and potions and be looking further a field for their thrills.

[James D. Macdonald]

There isn't a lot of YA SF out there because there isn't a lot being written. I know of at least one house that has an active program and is looking for submissions.

[astonwest]

I started to think that my previous book would have qualified as YA SF...
but then the alarm went off, and I woke up.

[Garpy]

Ahem....any clues who they might be, James?

Actually, that probably wont do me any good. I heard somewhere that US publishers arent too keen at taking on Brit writers right now.

[sunandshadow]

Animorphs is a popular YA sci-fi series. There is a line of YA Star Trek books. And what movie was my little brother watching the other day... Timestoppers, maybe it was called? And that live action Inspector Gadget movie a few years ago. There are some brilliant YA sci-fi graphic novels and anime series, like Crest of the Stars, Uninhabited Planet Survive, Starship Operators, Irresponsible Captain Tylor...

But certainly there aren't as many YA sci-fi books as fantasy ones. If I had to guess why, I would say that a writer interested in doing sci-fi worldbuilding would probably be unsatisfied to make something simple enough for kids to understand. But, that might just be my perspective since I write SFF for adults but would probably lose my mind trying to think appropriately for a YA book.

[Saanen]

Try various books by Jane Yolen, Diana Wynne Jones, Robert C. O'Brien, Anne McCaffrey, and Terry Pratchett. If you think of all these authors as fantasy writers exclusively you haven't been looking beyond the cover art. The dragons in Jane Yolen's Dragon's Blood books are not fantasy dragons--they're purely SF, and the books take place on another planet; Diana Wynne Jones' YA SF books include Homeward Bounders, Archer's Goon, and A Tale of Time City; Robert C. O'Brien, of course, wrote Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH, which unlike the cartoon is completely SF; Anne McCaffrey's dragons in the Pern series are bioengineered, and she has many other SF books besides, some appropriate for YA; and Terry Pratchett's Nome trilogy and Johnny Maxwell trilogy are SF. I also recommend Nancy Farmer's The Ear, The Eye, and The Arm, which is a Newbery Honor book.

[Dru]

My current WIP is SF, right on the borderline of YA-teen<->adult, so I did the 'ramble through the YA section' trying to find similar books and authors, agents and publishers. Right now the world of the fantastic (mundane) world more or less has the collective mindshare, but there are plenty of authors with in-print stories that are serial and stand alone SF.

I have found that bookstore to bookstore there are huge variances in how and where things are grouped, especially for hard-to-categorize SF. One store will have the classic juveniles (Heinlein, McCaffrey, Yolen, Jones) in regular fiction, and another will have them grouped in their own areas.

Are you looking for a way to figure out who to submit to, or looking for authors?

Publishers won't care if you're a thirteen-foot alien from the Far Arm if the story works, don't count yourself out of the game until you get thirty replies from publishers or agents saying "We'd buy your story if you weren't a Brit".

[Canada James]

I've been asked by more than a few publishers if I have anything "YA teen" ready to go. There's a huge market for it.


As for titles to look at for sci fi, that all depends on what age you're writing for. Do you mean Juvenile YA or Teen YA?

Juvenile-
Artemis Foul, Enders Game (the first book), Dirt Eaters, Mokee Joe, and Captain Fact all come to mind.

Teen-
Mortal Engines, Enders Game (the later books), and Eye of the Wolf.

That should get you started.

From your friendly neighbourhood bookseller,
Canada James

[alaskamatt17]

Uncle Jim, would you please be kind enough to divulge the name of this house that is actively seeking YA sci-fi? I have the peculiar feeling that my finished novel, Orion's Key, would qualify as such. Also, it's about dinosaurs, which seem to be a perennial topic of interest for young audiences.

Thanks.

[Jamesaritchie]

It might be mentioned that if you all go to Uncle Jim's website, and read a certan rant there by a Dr. Doyle, you'll learn some really cool things about YA science fiction. It certainly opened my eyes. I loved her take on it.

[Zolah]

I would have thought that young hungry readers would by now have begun to tire a bit of spells and potions and be looking further a field for their thrills.

They are. Sci-fi is a rising star in YA and ch's lit at the moment. In a couple of years you'll see these books starting to win the awards, but at the moment they're still what fantasy was about seven years ago - an underground movement, selling mostly through online enthusiasm and word of mouth. In the meantime, I happen to know a lovely editor who is slavering for some GOOD sci-fi for teens. He works at Walker Books (the UK one) so if you've got something that's a bit special send it on in to them and it will get a fair reading.

[alaskamatt17]

Thanks for the lead!

Tor books is the house Uncle Jim was talking about.

[azbikergirl]

How is YA defined, in general? Does it mean the MC must be under 21? Under 18? Is there no drinking, sex, violence or swearing?

[Saanen]

It depends on the house, but in general YA has MCs who are from about 12-17, there is drinking/sex only if it's the focus of the novel (and almost always shown to have negative consequences), mild to no swearing, and moderate, fairly bloodless violence. Exceptions abound, of course. Above all, don't assume your audience isn't sophisticated--you'd be surprised at what the typical YA reader can understand, as long as the writing isn't too convoluted (think spare, not simplified).

[Zolah]

How is YA defined, in general? Does it mean the MC must be under 21? Under 18? Is there no drinking, sex, violence or swearing?

My advice to you is to read 'How I Live Now' by Meg Rosoff. This is a fairly recent YA book that has won multiple awards and become a bestseller. It's fabulous and I love it, but I bet anyone who doesn't read much YA will be pretty shocked. It shows how far you can go in a YA book, so long as your writing and themes are strong enough.

[Christine N.]

Here's the thing, I think - not as many boys read as girls. I have this from several authorities; namely grade school librarians. And for some reason, girls like fantasy better than SF.

We need more SF... we need more 'boy books'. I haven't a clue what makes a good boy book, but there's definately a market for them.

Of course, my two year old boy is an avid reader. Meaning, "mommy, read this to me" is what I hear all day long. LOL

[ted_curtis]

It depends on the house, but in general YA has MCs who are from about 12-17, there is drinking/sex only if it's the focus of the novel (and almost always shown to have negative consequences), mild to no swearing, and moderate, fairly bloodless violence. Exceptions abound, of course. Above all, don't assume your audience isn't sophisticated--you'd be surprised at what the typical YA reader can understand, as long as the writing isn't too convoluted (think spare, not simplified).

Gosh, I've sort of had the opposite experience. YA has teen protagonists who do a lot of swearing, drinking, and carousing. Usually the focus is a teen-oriented problem, which is where it's different from adult novels, I think. After all, most young teens have the vocabulary and reading stamina to finish adult books.

I'd also say all writers should aim for writing that isn't too convoluted. Unless you're writing for the "unread, super-literary, but-looks-good-on-the-shelf" genre.

And the kiss of death in a YA manuscript is talking down to the readers.

Just my two cents.

Ted

[Canada James]

It depends on the house, but in general YA has MCs who are from about 12-17, there is drinking/sex only if it's the focus of the novel (and almost always shown to have negative consequences), mild to no swearing, and moderate, fairly bloodless violence. Exceptions abound, of course. Above all, don't assume your audience isn't sophisticated--you'd be surprised at what the typical YA reader can understand, as long as the writing isn't too convoluted (think spare, not simplified).

I would strongly suggest reading some YA fiction to decide what house will accept what in their YA fiction. There's a huge difference between the "tween" books (11-13), that could be described as you have above, and the "teen" books (14-19), that more often than not rely on sex, drugs and rock 'n roll as their plot driver.

Homework this week:
Reservoir Blues (one of my favourites)
Gossip Girls
Sloppy Firsts

Canada James

[Canada James]

Here's the thing, I think - not as many boys read as girls ... we need more 'boy books'. I haven't a clue what makes a good boy book, but there's definitely a market for them.

There are two ways to categorize this:
(1) High Interest/Low Level for the boys who are teens but reading at an elementary school level. These books are typically short and pocket-sized (so the boys can hide them from their friends)

(2) Reluctant Reader - this is for the boys who can read at their level but need books with minimal description and more action. These books are typically longer (some into the 200 page count), and often turn into series.

Homework-
(1) For this group I'm a fan of the Orca Soundings.Teen issues, teen protagonists, well-written and at a grade 4/5 level.

(2) For this group I've had a lot of success with the Pendragon series, Darren Shan books, and the Alex Rider series.

C. James

[Canada James]

I'd also say all writers should aim for writing that isn't too convoluted. Unless you're writing for the "unread, super-literary, but-looks-good-on-the-shelf" genre.

Homework (authors):
Celia Rees
Jan Mark

Both are authors for teens who are extremely convoluted and look great on international best-seller lists.
Personally, I don't like them.

C. James

[Mike Coombes]

I've always had a bit of a problem with the YA label.

When I was 11 I discovered SF, which I read voraciously. Lots of junk I don't remember now, but Asimov, Heinlein etc were being devoured before I was in my teens.
My experience with my own kids is that they sought out what worked for them, not books designed to appeal to their generation.

[Canada James]

I've always had a bit of a problem with the YA label. My experience with my own kids is that they sought out what worked for them, not books designed to appeal to their generation.

YA is a fairly new genre. Didn't exist at all when I was a teen; of course, I would have read more if it had.

C. James

[Jamesaritchie]

YA is a fairly new genre. Didn't exist at all when I was a teen; of course, I would have read more if it had.

C. James

Seems to me that YA has been around an awful lot of years. Wouldn't The Hardy Boys, Nancy Drew, and even Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn be considered young adult fiction? They're all listed as YA now. So are many of Heinlein's books, and Isaac Asmiov wrote a number of Lucky Starr books under the name Paul French that were published as YA.

I'm 51 now, and when I was eight years old I had an entire bureau full of books that were all considered young adult fiction by my teachers.

I also had a whole batch of WWII commando books published in England that were called Young Adult.

[victoriastrauss]

I grew up on YA books like Johnny Tremaine and The Witch of Blackbird Pond. YA was certainly an established genre when I published my first YA book in 1982.

Something that is new is the idea of having dedicated imprints for YA fantasy and SF. Until just a few years ago, YA fantasy and SF was published alongside mainstream YA titles. The specialist imprints are a direct result of the popularity of Harry Potter.

- Victoria

[Canada James]

I grew up on YA books like Johnny Tremaine and The Witch of Blackbird Pond. YA was certainly an established genre when I published my first YA book in 1982.

Yes, there has always been fiction with teen characters. However, time travel back to 1982, and I bet your publisher didn't have the terms "chick-lit", "Boy Books", "Reluctant Reader Fiction" or "Hi/Low".

In fact, I'd be willing to bet there were no publishers that specialized in the genre exclusively.

C. James

[victoriastrauss]

However, time travel back to 1982, and I bet your publisher didn't have the terms "chick-lit", "Boy Books", "Reluctant Reader Fiction" or "Hi/Low".Kids' books back then were categorized by age groups, from pre-school to young adult--publishing was a lot smaller two decades ago, and the kind of subcategorization and sub-subcategorization you see now (in all markets, not just children's and YA) didn't exist.
In fact, I'd be willing to bet there were no publishers that specialized in the genre exclusively.Possibly not, though I couldn't say for sure. However, my agent marketed my book as YA, and it eventually sold to a publisher that specialized in books for children and teens.

- Victoria

[Jamesaritchie]

Having thought about this a bit, I think all that's really happened is that the term has changed. What is now called "young adult" fiction is the same thing that was called "juvenile" fiction when I was young. Several publishers had lines of fiction that published what were called "juvenile," and several of Heinlein's novels, and Asimov's Paul French novels, were published under the label "juvenile."

I'd say the term became politically incorrect at some point, maybe because of the association with "juvenile delinquent," which is also a phrase I never hear these days.

My local library had a children's department back then, but it also had a subsection labelled "juvenile" fiction intended for teen readers.

So I think what's really new is the term "young adult," not the kind of fiction that's published, or the age group it's aimed at.

[alaskamatt17]

Juvenile probably became politically incorrect because of its connotations. To many, "juvenile" is just another way of saying "immature." It is quite obvious to most people now that youth and immaturity do not always go hand in hand. Think about some one trying to classify Ender's Game as juvenile--it doesn't make any sense. But the same book fits well under the young adult label.