Obese woman forced to buy 2 plane tickets

[John Paton]

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,25001569-662,00.html

"they advised me to book and pay for a second seat for other people’s comfort because of my size … and, would you believe, they then made a further mistake which I later noticed on the web by splitting up my seats so they weren’t next to each other."

This poor lady has had quite an ordeal. She weighs 160kgs and has been advised she needs to purchase 2 tickets when she flies.

But according to the Canadians

"there was a court ruling last November that overweight people could have two seats for the price of one"

I know weight is a very sensitive issue but how do we react when next to some poor person on an aircraft who is seriously overweight ??

[Lyra Jean]

I was on a greyhound bus window seat. When I fall asleep I lean against the window so as not to fall asleep on the person sitting next to me. If the bus is empty enough I try to get two seats to myself and sleep that way.

Anyway, guy sits next to me. He takes up his seat and half of my seat. Then he falls asleep and starts leaning towards me. I had to stay like that for over an hour until the next bus stop. So yeah, sorry I think they should have to purchase two seats. It's cool if they can get both for the price of one I don't care. I think it's horrible of the industry to put her two seats in different locations that kind of defeats the purpose.

[Lyra Jean]

I read the article and I think they gave this chick the run around. They didn't want to admit their mistakes and tried to cover up what they said. But I still think that if you take up two seats you should buy two seats. If Canada says they can get two seats for the price of one and that law applies then the airline shouldn't break the law.

[poetinahat]

The legal decision is one thing, and fair enough.

If you ship goods overseas, you pay per container, not for "one person's stuff".

[Joe270]

If you ship goods overseas, you pay per container, not for "one person's stuff".


Don't folks usually ship by weight?

Now that could make for some interesting plane fares. I'd get Vegas to Dallas for $400, but Ralphie May would pay $1850, and Kate Moss would see a fare of some 57 cents.

Of course, Ralphe would get three seats, I'd get one, and Kate would get an arm rest.

Just the arm rest, no seat, no belt, and no peanuts.

[thethinker42]

I'm not sure how I feel about this, but...

I just flew across the Pacific on a 777. Long, miserable flight. I'm not tiny, but I'm certainly not large, either, and I was uncomfortable as hell...the seats are narrow, the elbow room is such a hot commodity that people will fight to the death for it, and leg room is scarce even for someone like me who is 5'8".

I know people who are obese still need to travel, just like the rest of us...and I cringe at the thought of penalizing someone because of their size...but as someone whose joints are still cracking from being shoehorned into something smaller than the plane's glove compartment, I can see where the airlines are coming from. I once flew across the U.S. wedged in between two people who were quite large. I can't imagine it was any more comfortable for them than it was for me.

There's no easy, politically correct solution, but with seating configurations getting tighter and tighter, something has to give.

That said, my dad works directly with the airlines on things like seat configurations. I have given him a hearty piece of my mind about the lack of space in coach...

[Phoebe H]

Don't folks usually ship by weight?

Depends *completely* on the freight company, and the commodity you are shipping. The freight rate for mattresses and box springs, for instance, will be a whole lot more per hundredweight than will the freight rate for rebar, because it takes up a lot more space per pound. And volume is every bit as much a limiting factor as weight.

And, of course, the relationship with the shipper makes a big difference, too. A company that ships a lot of goods to and from the same place will often negotiate a per container rate, just to make things easier on everybody. A flat rate makes for a lot less administrative work on both ends.

Can you tell who worked for several years as a Rate Specialist at a Common Carrier? Man, I used to have our tariff memorized.

[RobJ]

Obese woman forced to buy 2 plane tickets
That's okay as a first draft. During revision you could change it to something like:

Woman who takes up two seats asked to pay for two seats.

But seriously, planes are made for people, not the other way around. If the seats don't cater for larger people, maybe they should. I know there has to be a limit somewhere, but there's a lot of large people out there. It wouldn't require every seat to be larger, just to have a few larger seats available for those who need them.

And a bed, for those of us who like to sleep during the flight.

Cheers,
Rob

[scarletpeaches]

...He takes up his seat and half of my seat. Then he falls asleep and starts leaning towards me. I had to stay like that for over an hour until the next bus stop...

If that ever happens to me I wake the person up.

[Lyra Jean]

If that ever happens to me I wake the person up.

I tried. I even tried shoving them toward the other direction. I think the bus stopping woke them up. I'm just glad that buses don't have assigned seats I moved as soon as he got up.

[StoryG27]

I understand making someone who takes two seats pay for both seats, but in this case, her seats weren't together. The airline made a mistake, didn't want to admit it.

As for the bus story, in high school, I was taking the bus back from visiting some family and I never sleep on buses, but I wasn't feeling well and took some meds that knocked me out. The bus was packed! We had three people sitting where only two should. I, of course, fell asleep. I felt sooooo bad when I woke up with my head on the bony shoulder of the old man sitting next to me. He said I'd been sleeping like that for the last three hours. I apologized and he seemed pretty tolerant of it. I was really embarrassed though, I think I drooled just a little on his shirt. Oops.

[Don Allen]

No one will like this post, and I'm not going to judge anyone because as you can see by my picture I could lose a few, but at some point we all have to stop eating ourselves into oblivion and maybe making us pay for being fat is the answer....

[donroc]

I was on a flight a few years ago, and they allowed an obese person to overflow beyond the arm and edge of his aisle seat with no seatbelt attached of course, and he blocked a good chunk of the narrow aisle as well.

[Don Allen]

Well, I think the world of political correctness has to take a back seat to safety and common sense, especially in issues as sensitive as this. I've heard every argument in the world as to why the obese and severely overweight people should be treated as everyone else, but the fact of the matter is that they can't. Airplanes aren't equipped to handle people over 300 pounds any more than they're equipped to handle large framed men who may be over 6' 5" and weigh upwards of 300 pounds.

The only logical answer is to give these people more space and that comes with a cost, I don't see it as discrimination, I see it as accommodation. You are what you are, some people can't lose the weight anymore than a physically large person can chop off their legs.

[MattW]

Airlines discriminate against tall people too. But there's no Brobdingnag lobby.

[Don Allen]

I think we simo posted matt.

[Plot Device]

I tried. I even tried shoving them toward the other direction. I think the bus stopping woke them up. I'm just glad that buses don't have assigned seats I moved as soon as he got up.

That might have been his goal all along.

[Plot Device]

I understand making someone who takes two seats pay for both seats, but in this case, her seats weren't together. The airline made a mistake, didn't want to admit it.

As for the bus story, in high school, I was taking the bus back from visiting some family and I never sleep on buses, but I wasn't feeling well and took some meds that knocked me out. The bus was packed! We had three people sitting where only two should. I, of course, fell asleep. I felt sooooo bad when I woke up with my head on the bony shoulder of the old man sitting next to me. He said I'd been sleeping like that for the last three hours. I apologized and he seemed pretty tolerant of it. I was really embarrassed though, I think I drooled just a little on his shirt. Oops.

1) Maybe he enjoyed it. (In a fatherly way.)

2) Stories like this freak me out over the possibility of getting head lice. I got it once in my life --as an adult-- and I vowed it would never happen again.

[Don Allen]

1)

2) Stories like this freak me out over the possibility of getting head lice. I got it once in my life --as an adult-- and I vowed it would never happen again.


A bit too much info PD...?????

[Plot Device]

Airlines discriminate against tall people too. But there's no Brobdingnag lobby.


Actually, I think there is --a very small (no pun intended) yet vocal group.

[Plot Device]

A bit too much info PD...?????


What??

And confessions of having drooled on someone's shirt are okay? :)

[Lyra Jean]

That might have been his goal all along.

Except there were plenty of empty seats on the bus. Unless he wanted that particular spot. I would have totally moved if he asked me too. What's done is done. I have a car now so I'll probably just drive next time I visit my mom.

[Julie Worth]

I know weight is a very sensitive issue but how do we react when next to some poor person on an aircraft who is seriously overweight ??

When someone spills over the armrest, I stick them with my voodoo nails.

[DeleyanLee]

Airlines make their money by seat. If two seats are filled, then two prices should be paid. It just makes economical sense. As a morbidly obese/fat person, I expect that if I need the room, I'll have to pay for it. It's just fair.

Now, I wouldn't mind it if the second seat I might require on some airlines might get a slight discount because I'm not really two people, but I know that's not going to be the case. It makes a difference whether or not I choose to fly and which airlines I choose to book on. I'm afraid I have a very un-PC attitude called "responsibility for self" when it comes to making decisions. It's no one else's responsibility to do something special for me because I'm fat. My life, my body, my responsibility to deal with all the costs and bothers of it.

Now, the airline being so incompetent that they couldn't put the lady's two seats together--that's a totally different topic and one they should wear egg-on-their-face for a while.

[Don Allen]

Airlines make their money by seat. If two seats are filled, then two prices should be paid. It just makes economical sense. As a morbidly obese/fat person, I expect that if I need the room, I'll have to pay for it. It's just fair.

Now, I wouldn't mind it if the second seat I might require on some airlines might get a slight discount because I'm not really two people, but I know that's not going to be the case. It makes a difference whether or not I choose to fly and which airlines I choose to book on. I'm afraid I have a very un-PC attitude called "responsibility for self" when it comes to making decisions. It's no one else's responsibility to do something special for me because I'm fat. My life, my body, my responsibility to deal with all the costs and bothers of it.

Now, the airline being so incompetent that they couldn't put the lady's two seats together--that's a totally different topic and one they should wear egg-on-their-face for a while.

Great post....

[ClaudiaGray]

I agree that it's fair to have someone pay for the full space they take up, though advance warning -- and better judgment than this airline used! -- would be helpful.

I also agree that airlines/airplane designers probably need to accept that, unlike their seats, people are not getting any smaller. I don't think they need to make planes with barcaloungers to accommodate the widest people in the world, but OTOH, they have us crammed into spots that are exceedingly uncomfortable even for people of average height and weight.

[MattW]

Incrementally adjustable seats for tall and/or obese people.

You just have to submit to full body measurements before boarding, and pay accordingly.

[Kate Thornton]

But seriously, planes are made for people, not the other way around. If the seats don't cater for larger people, maybe they should. I know there has to be a limit somewhere, but there's a lot of large people out there. It wouldn't require every seat to be larger, just to have a few larger seats available for those who need them.
Cheers,
Rob

Yes - this is clearly the solution - if the average traveler needs more room (and we do, as a group we have become larger - including taller - in the last 100 years) then the seats need to be bigger.

If you are disabled, like me, it is a nightmare all around to fly, from having to disrobe in public at security, to having to somehow negotiate the narrow aisle to sitting in cramped discomfort for the duration of the flight. Don't even get into the luggage problem - I cannot use the overhead compartments or underseat area as I only have one working arm, so I pay for a checked suitcase.

If the seat were larger and the aisle a bit wider, it would be so much easier for me and a lot of other people. We are not all 5'3" and 100 lbs.

Yes, we get to pre-board. That is a mercy. And I always wait to exit until the craft is empty.

I love my local movie theater which has a row of seating for the disabled who can't get up the steps and for people in chairs with attendants. These seats are larger, too - and I have no heartburn if large people use them.

And just for the record, I am not overweight or really tall (5'5" and below 140) and the damned airliner seats are too small for me too. I'm happy not to have to fly on business anymore.

[GeorgeK]

I think they should weigh people with their luggage at check in, not just the luggage and then charge an extra fee for space and weight if either is outside whatever they've calculated for the space or fuel etc. From a fuel standpoint, how is one 300 pound person any different than a 150 pound person with 150 pounds of luggage?

From a space standpoint, the skinny person paid for their seat too. They should get to use their entire seat. It's not fair to them to say the person next to them gets to use half of their seat. If you want the arm rest up, there could be an extra fee and you may need permission from (or bribe) the person next to you. Splitting up the seats for this person...that was just plain retarded.

In a crash, people become projectiles. If someone can not be restrained for whatever reason, because the belt won't fit, or they are afraid of nylon or whatever, they should not fly.

[Greenify13]

Well, I find this ridiculus especially considering the two required seats were seperate. While I disagree with this, I have to admit if you think about it, if the seats were adjoined then it should be more of a safety reason then merely "other peoples comfort." If God forbid...something happened to said planes, the woman would have not been adequately seated and secured, and may have further caused issues for surrounding passengers. (Or something like that...)

[GeorgeK]

If there are adjoining seats, couldn't the person simply put down the armrest, sit in the middle and use the left half of the belt from the left seat, and the right half from the right seat? I can't see why that wouldn't work, but it's been a long time since I've flown and that isn't my specialty.

[MattW]

If there are adjoining seats, couldn't the person simply put down the armrest, sit in the middle and use the left half of the belt from the left seat, and the right half from the right seat? I can't see why that wouldn't work, but it's been a long time since I've flown and that isn't my specialty.They'd probably still need a seat belt extender. Which I'm not sure all planes have.

[Devil Ledbetter]

That's okay as a first draft. During revision you could change it to something like:

Woman who takes up two seats asked to pay for two seats.

But seriously, planes are made for people, not the other way around. If the seats don't cater for larger people, maybe they should. I know there has to be a limit somewhere, but there's a lot of large people out there. It wouldn't require every seat to be larger, just to have a few larger seats available for those who need them.

And a bed, for those of us who like to sleep during the flight.

Cheers,
RobThere are larger seats. It's called First Class.

[veinglory]

How could they give advance warning unless people declare their weight and girth when they book?

No matter how big seats are some people will be bigger--there is a trade off somewhere.

[Joe270]

Well, I find this ridiculus especially considering the two required seats were seperate.

Well, damn it, she should have split like an Amoeba then.

Airlines and their often stupid decisions have filled news stories for years, but now, thanks the the Patriot Act, they can arrest anyone they want for anything they consider 'disruptive'. Franky, this woman is lucky that she wasn't arrested because she was of a 'disruptive' size.

This is an abuse of the Patriot Act, which needs to be corrected.

Airlines are not always right. When my son was still quite young, we went on a flight where we were urged, by the airline, to get him a seat and bring a car seat. After they pointed out that any accident would likely kill a 'lap child', we decided on the seat. Besides, it would give us more room to stow all the baby bags, etc. which two young children seem to 'need'. (I have never quite gotten over the fact that two tiny children require four times more luggage than my wife and I combined.)

Because the flight was overbooked, they started pressuring us to 'lap child' our son. I quoted their own recommendations, which only made them angry. They called us 'unreasonable', and other stuff which I didn't much appreciate. They put a lot of pressure on us to give up the seat. We didn't, and they scowled at us for the entire four-hour flight.

If that happened today, we'd be booted and arrested under the loose interpretation which the airlines have been using of the Patriot Act.

[GeorgeK]

Because the flight was overbooked, they started pressuring us to 'lap child' our son. I quoted their own recommendations, which only made them angry. They called us 'unreasonable', and other stuff which I didn't much appreciate. They put a lot of pressure on us to give up the seat. We didn't, and they scowled at us for the entire four-hour flight.

If that happened today, we'd be booted and arrested under the loose interpretation which the airlines have been using of the Patriot Act.

If you paid for the seat, then it shouldn't matter if you even just wanted the elbow room and a place to rest your coat. It's your seat. I was in the same situation, but the flight attendant pointed out to some last minute would be customer that I had purchased tickets for each of my kids.

[Devil Ledbetter]

Well, damn it, she should have split like an Amoeba then.

Airlines and their often stupid decisions have filled news stories for years, but now, thanks the the Patriot Act, they can arrest anyone they want for anything they consider 'disruptive'. Franky, this woman is lucky that she wasn't arrested because she was of a 'disruptive' size.

This is an abuse of the Patriot Act, which needs to be corrected.

Airlines are not always right. When my son was still quite young, we went on a flight where we were urged, by the airline, to get him a seat and bring a car seat. After they pointed out that any accident would likely kill a 'lap child', we decided on the seat. Besides, it would give us more room to stow all the baby bags, etc. which two young children seem to 'need'. (I have never quite gotten over the fact that two tiny children require four times more luggage than my wife and I combined.)

Because the flight was overbooked, they started pressuring us to 'lap child' our son. I quoted their own recommendations, which only made them angry. They called us 'unreasonable', and other stuff which I didn't much appreciate. They put a lot of pressure on us to give up the seat. We didn't, and they scowled at us for the entire four-hour flight.

If that happened today, we'd be booted and arrested under the loose interpretation which the airlines have been using of the Patriot Act.You were wise not to give it up. My dad was on a flight that had an aborted take off. He described a lap baby somersaulting down the aisle "like a bowling ball" and slamming into the cockpit door. An ambulance had to be summoned.

It's really not worth saving a few hundred bucks. I think if one can't afford to purchase her child a proper seat, one simply can't afford to fly.

[Shadow_Ferret]

Airlines should charge per pound/kilo.