Amateur needs help

[Berlovska]

How do you start to write the books? I've done a few articles, different lenths, different subjects + essays + miniatures. The most of them are dictated by my willing to express own feelings. That case when you h a v e to say something so badly that you cannot keep your mouth shut. But now I have an idea that could be expand to at least couple hundred pages, but needs to be framed in the characters and dialogues, a plot and conflict. And here is my problem - I d o n o t b e l i e v e in what I'm writing. Because no "I", no "me", no real thing. Even the things that I try to make up are very coming and could be applied not only to me, but to everybody. Isn't called "typical"? So, how to make my writing (a fiction) to breathe for the author myself? Not just feeble words...
(English is a second language for me, I do write in Russian, but the problem is universal, I guess) Thanks!

[azbikergirl]

I start with a character. I think about this theoretical character in such detail that he becomes real in my mind. Then I put him in a situation that will force him to dig deep within himself to find strengths he didn't know he had in order to solve the problems.

[Kida Adelyne]

Just write it! Come up with a character who believes in it, and listen to what they have to tell you- and the world. Don't think about it- just write it. It will end up being true to you that way.

[Berlovska]

Well, what if I want to make my charachters to say what I want? Am not I a creator? I create them because I want them to speak for me. Maybe that's why I don't trust them. 'cause they are not I(me)...
Should I love them? Should I respect them then? How to find the compromise between what I want and what they want? I write because I have the idea, they are only providers...
Weird...

[katdad]

When I first began to write fiction, I tried to make the characters move and talk like robots -- I was the puppeteer and they were marionettes, I was pulling the strings.

This did not work -- everything was lifeless and thin.

As I became more skilled, I learned what I needed to do -- I tried to create real, living characters (even if they were totally ficticious) and I put the character into a situation to see what they would do. Then I simply sat back and took notes -- I recorded the events and words as if I was watching the show on TV or in a movie.

Of course the entire event is occurring inside my brain all the time, but it was as if I was fooling myself, creating an independent area in my mind where the characters behaved as if they were real, and then I was simply the observer.

If you do this, your writing will become strong and solid, and it will have life.

To create realistic human characters, try to create a biography for them. How they grew up, where they went to school, their friends, their likes and dislikes, their strengths and weaknesses. You may wish to actually write down a biography for your major characters and keep it available for your thought process.

Of course you must become skilled in writing too -- if you cannot write the events in a good way, nothing will happen. But you must also "Believe" in your characters -- think of them as real people with real life and real memories of their own. That is the only way you can write good stories that are vivid.

I have a very prized letter from Thomas Harris (author of Silence of the Lambs). He told me that if you do not believe in your characters, you cannot expect an agent or publisher or the readers to believe in them either.

[Berlovska]

Katdad! Thanks a lot for your detailed explanation how to work with the charachters. Isn't it difficult to keep all these things going on at the same time? Plot, style, ideas, charachters... Only one way to get rid of them - to write out them of the head. We are all crazy people... (writers)

[Berlovska]

Another question - but where to start? With creating the charachters or event? What goes first?

[Nateskate]

It's easiest if you have a rudimentary concept of the story line. Most of the time I begin with this simple concept and built.

Years ago, I wrote a sci fi thriller. I wrote it free-hand, and it's not likely to move from the closet where I left it, waiting to pay a typist to type it, but it was a decent enough story.

It started with a simple concept. When they first began toying with virtual reality, I came up with an idea. An international arms group wanted to take advantage of weaponized virtual reality, used in torture, to perfect to sell to the highest bidders. In essence the thought was they could break down the most hardened soldiers/spies through making it impossible for the prisoner to distinguish reality from virtual reality. In essense, a man thinking he was actually in hell would tell you anything to get out.

But it starts as a seed, and then you have to add questions. Who would they get to experiment on? "Transients with no background."

Well, they'd use them up, leaving them virtual vegetables, and dump them back on the streets. They have no signs of trauma, or infections, presumed to be drug addicts that fried their brains.

So, you have a bad guy, this evil weapons syndicate. You have victims. Now, you have to make a reason why someone would care about these vegetables found on the streets. Obviously, the old, "They abducted someone that mattered." is the handiest excuse to begin investigating, "What's happening here?"

Start with the seed idea, ponder it. Build on it.

And strangely, I used a nurse and another employee in a nursing home as the protagonists, two people not happy with the over abundance of new alzheimers patients who can't remember their names. But they learn they can re-teach them, and this triggers the notions, "They aren't alzheimers patients. Their memories were simply erased. Administration who doesn't care what a nurse thinks? Pisses her off. She and this guy decide to solve the mystery. (Budding romance added to the story).

People get sucked in over their heads. They plant someone hoping to get him abducted to trace him, and lose him. Things get nasty, they can't go to the authorities, they turn to a friend from a wacko paramilitary group, who is gung ho, and now you have all kinds of stuff happening.

But it started with thoughts on virtual reality, and what it might be used for.

[Berlovska]

So, in other words, you don't have to have a mentally written book with all these scenes and details. I have the idea (seed) what it could be about... Even how it could be... But no details, no ready solutions by now.
Nice to know that a direction where I move is right. Thanks a bundle!

[Nateskate]

So, in other words, you don't have to have a mentally written book with all these scenes and details. I have the idea (seed) what it could be about... Even how it could be... But no details, no ready solutions by now.
Nice to know that a direction where I move is right. Thanks a bundle!

You are welcome. Each person probably thinks differently on this. However, it works that way for me.

But here's a trick. If you have a rudimentary seed of an idea, the first character you add to the story changes its direction. Because as Katdad said, if you see through the eyes of that character, you begin to add dimension. Each other character also adds dimension. Adding characters has changed the direction of some stories I wrote, because I loved the character I created so much, I wanted to add storyline for them.

For instance, when I created the nurse, and I forget the title of the other "Nutritionist?" - maybe. They were both single. Working closely together with someone attractive can cause sparks. That adds a new dimension.

[Berlovska]

Damn it! Then more I ask then more I have to ask. Anyway, how do you write? I see my writing like a thing that has the dimentions. OK, I have couple (three+) charachters, a have the conflict between them (what kind of problem they have to solve), and the event (what happens to them to help to solve this). Also some secondary level stuff - the little scenes, the dialogues - that are clear in my head. But how to write them down? As a line -

he did that,
she will do that,
they are doing this,
fine, we have something.

I'm a little bit confused of more than one thing going on in my writing. I already mentioned that I dealed only with "one charachter/one event/short period of time" before. Now it's a few layers that I want to compose, but how?

[Berlovska]

I see your post, Nateskate. - right after I posted mine. OK, I see that it could be more unpredictable than I thought.

[azbikergirl]

I picture a movie in my head, and I write down what happens, but I include the character's thoughts and feelings (or sometimes go back and add them later). Sometimes the first sentence is the hardest because where do we begin? IMO, it's best to just pick a place for the first draft. Get the character out of bed, for instance, the morning The Inciting Incident happens. He doesn't see what's coming, he goes about his dreary life, then Wham! He's running for his life. Later, when you know more about what happens, when, who's there, etc., you can change the starting point. But the only way to get going is to start.

[LightShadow]

First, come up with a situation, and see how your characters respond. Then just write whatever comes to your head, junk, typo's, whatever. It is just a shell. A chicken scratch on a canvas. Then go back to it and breath life into it. New characters will develope, plots will lengthen. Color will fill the canvas that was only pencil drawings before.

[Berlovska]

Thanks - I appreciate your posts! Let me try this way.

[Fractured_Chaos]

Well, what if I want to make my charachters to say what I want? Am not I a creator?

Best suggestion I've heard. Create a character. Get to know that character intimately, like he was a real person, with strengths and weaknesses, and personality quirks. Then drop him in a situation that will take some work to get him out of, and let -him- do the work, and say what needs to be said.

I create them because I want them to speak for me. Maybe that's why I don't trust them. 'cause they are not I(me)...

I'm not going to make any assumptions on your spiritual beliefs, but think of this, (if you believe, if not, you probably know someone who does)..."The Creator" is a good analogy for what you're doing. You are creating a universe, and putting people in it. Ask anyone of faith, and of any faith, and you will get practically the same answer...the "Creator" put them here, and created the universe, but doesn't dictate their every move. They have the ability to make their own choices. The "Creator" only created the situation.

If you -know- your character, trust him. The character is not you, and he will do things that you would never do in that situation.

When that happens, you know you're on the right track. ;)

Should I love them? Should I respect them then?

You don't have to love the character. In fact, some characters are impossible to love. But always, always respect them. Even if that character is the evilest thing to walk your universe, respect him. That respect makes your character more believable.

How to find the compromise between what I want and what they want? I write because I have the idea, they are only providers...
Weird...

Tough question. All you can do is work with the story until you find the right balance. Every story is different. Sometimes it's like you and the character agree on everything, and sometimes its like the two of you are fighting every step of the way. If you have children, you know -exactly- how that feels. And you -know- you have to eventually let those kids make their own decisions, yes?

[Fractured_Chaos]

So, in other words, you don't have to have a mentally written book with all these scenes and details. I have the idea (seed) what it could be about... Even how it could be... But no details, no ready solutions by now.
Nice to know that a direction where I move is right. Thanks a bundle!

Most of the time, all you need to do is ask, "What if...?" And go from there.

[Fractured_Chaos]

OK, I have couple (three+) charachters, a have the conflict between them (what kind of problem they have to solve), and the event (what happens to them to help to solve this). Also some secondary level stuff - the little scenes, the dialogues - that are clear in my head. But how to write them down?

Start with the characters. If there is a conflict, obviously they each see the situation differently, and how to solve it differently. Just like in real life, when there is a conflict between several people, the stories and the reasons they each did what they did, or said what they said was all different. If you didn't have all the information, you would think that there were three different things going on, right?

In the story, you (the writer), are on the outside, and have all the facts. But each character might not. How each person perceives something is part and parcel to their personality, and life experiences up to that point. All you need to do, is make sure you're inside the character's head in a given situation, and only access the same information that particular character has (yeah, I know, easier said than done).

[Torin]

I often have very vivid dreams, and when I'm coordinated enough to write them down, they often provide me with characters or scenes to use as starting points. I used a dream as the starting point for my first novel, and for the saga I've been playing with for the past five or six years (and one of the offshoots of that has been picked up by eXtasy Books...I sent the contract off a little while ago). So I have a starting point and then just write to find out what happens next. :)

Good luck.

[Berlovska]

Dear Drgnlvr - thanks, it's really helpful. It's a matter of "controlling-letting go" process more than I thought. I thought I'm responsible of every word :) But it's even easir this way, because who a hell knows what will happen... A little scary, but oh, well, that's why we have what we have...

Torin - yeah, I think I have a starting point. But how do you know how many pages/words it will take?

[SRHowen]

Some people write an outline, a this is my list of characters and they are going to start out here and end up over there. They have a basic or detailed list of what they want the story to be. Some even go so far as to say in chapter one Sue and Bill will meet in a bar. In chapter two Sue and Bill will discover a dead body. In Chapter three . . . and so on.

Other people write "organically." They have the seed of an idea--hmm Sue goes to a bar on Saturday night. And that's it.

They put Sue on a street getting out of a cab in front of a bar and in she goes. They let "Sue" lead the way.

for those of us who write this way, it's not easy to explain. We don't know what is going to happen next, we don't know the end or many times (most of the time) even what the plot is going to be--say until there is a dragon in the bar, or a dad body in the street. We don't know why Sue picks up the quarter she sees and stuffs in it in her pocket--only to have her need it 4 chapters later. We don't plan it that way it just grows from that thought.

You don't know how many pages,, or how many words it will take, you write until you are done. You write until you come to a conclusion and climax of all events in the story.

Start with a scene and just write without thought and see where it takes you.

Shawn

[Bufty]

Berlovska,

We all write differently. I don't pre-plot. I place the character in a situation and let him/her show me how they react as opposed to my first saying 'now this is how the character is going to react'. Or I may have a ring at the doorbell, in which case I wait to find out who is there, as opposed to deciding that so-and-so will be there. Subtle difference. Doesn't work for everyone, but just a thought, and it can be quite revealing and exciting if you let your characters guide you.

Kindest, Bufty

[NicoleJLeBoeuf]

You don't have to love the character. In fact, some characters are impossible to love. But always, always respect them. Even if that character is the evilest thing to walk your universe, respect him. That respect makes your character more believable.One of the best bits of advice I ever heard was, "No one is the bad guy in his own autobiography." Not only does keeping that in mind go a long way towards helping me keep my fictional antagonists three-dimensional, but I find it's helpful in understanding real-life antagonists too.

[Berlovska]

Hmmm... I have an outline! Only I didn't know how it's called. I have a list of the characters, the scenes, the central image. And I love my idea - I know that it must work! Only... I feel like I'm only one who has this knowledge. And wonder - will people enjoy as well as I do? It's not about the murder or having sex (I don't have skills to describe such things), but about two people who try to have a relationship, but it doesn't work right the way, so it's a little funny, a little sad, and the end is - oh, well, now we have something. I'd call it "a psychological" prose if it isn't written in easy style... I feel like it must go from my heart, not from my "ratio" (including my degree+tons of the read books+etc)... How it make work...

[TheNightTerror]

Another question - but where to start? With creating the charachters or event? What goes first?

With me, it can go either way. I usually think of an event that would be fun to write, and go from there. But, with the last story I wrote, the characters came first. I'd been having a ton of fun with a friend of mine, and I wanted to write a story which could have a character like her in it, throwing in a character like me just for kicks.

It ended up being one of my weird suspense/romance mixes in the end, but before the crap hit the fan in the story, I kept the story fairly upbeat and cheerful. I had a total blast getting her character into situations that I could see us getting into. For example, getting into a race with a Mustang when we were in a huge Ford. Ironically enough, that actually happened a couple weeks ago, a shiny new Mustang challenged us when we were in a '97 F-250 crew cab pick-up with a diesel engine. Too bad it was so much smaller than us, we couldn't slip in and out of traffic like he did, otherwise it could've been quite the interesting race. :Shrug:

Should I love them? Should I respect them then?

I'd say you should love a few of them, at least, but respecting the bastards of the story is hard to do, to say the least, at times. I always love the main character, but I usually hate the antagonist.

Torin - yeah, I think I have a starting point. But how do you know how many pages/words it will take?

You haven't written anything fairly long before, right? You probably won't be able to tell for a while, it depends on how much story you want to tell. The last story I wrote, I remember starting it worrying that it might break 500 pages (with the printing formatting I use) about half way through, and what do you know, the version with the quickie ending did just that. :o

[Berlovska]

TheNightTerror - thanks! Actually, I changed suddenly my characters - they were too weak to survive. But instead I thought about others, which means it could be a different story. But! The concept is the same. What I've done - I just dig deeper into my ideas trying to figure out what can possibly work.

[LightShadow]

Berlovska, Don't forget, keep your characters honest. Keep them real. Get them stumped, and then see how they work their way out of it using reactions and responses that are real and consistent with their personality type.